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Patriots: The Vietnam War Remembered from All Sides
Christian G. Appy’s monumental oral history of the Vietnam War is the first work to probe the war’s path through both the United States and Vietnam. These vivid testimonies of 135 men and women span the entire history of the Vietnam conflict, from its murky origins in the 1940s to the chaotic fall of Saigon in 1975. Sometimes detached and reflective, often raw and emotional, they allow us to see and feel what this war meant to people literally on all sides—Americans and Vietnamese, generals and grunts, policymakers and protesters, guerrillas and CIA operatives, pilots and doctors, artists and journalists, and a variety of ordinary citizens whose lives were swept up in a cataclysm that killed three million people. By turns harrowing, inspiring, and revelatory, Patriots is not a chronicle of facts and figures but a vivid human history of the war.
612 pages, Kindle Edition
First published May 26, 2003
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June 14, 2022
in college i took a class on the vietnam war from all perspectives, and then i got to go there on spring break for $200.
it was probably the single best educational experience of my life, and this book is crucial.
part of a series i'm doing in which i review books i read a long time ago
it was probably the single best educational experience of my life, and this book is crucial.
part of a series i'm doing in which i review books i read a long time ago
June 26, 2014
-Detrás de todo evento hay personas. Detrás de una guerra, también.-
Género. Historia.
Lo que nos cuenta. Historia de la Guerra de Vietnam desde la perspectiva de una significativa cantidad de personas que estuvieron allÃ, de sus testimonios y vivencias, para ofrecer, como indica el subtÃtulo de la obra, “una historia oralâ€�.
¿Quiere saber más de este libro, sin spoilers? Visite:
Género. Historia.
Lo que nos cuenta. Historia de la Guerra de Vietnam desde la perspectiva de una significativa cantidad de personas que estuvieron allÃ, de sus testimonios y vivencias, para ofrecer, como indica el subtÃtulo de la obra, “una historia oralâ€�.
¿Quiere saber más de este libro, sin spoilers? Visite:
June 26, 2014
-Detrás de todo evento hay personas. Detrás de una guerra, también.-
Género. Historia.
Lo que nos cuenta. Historia de la Guerra de Vietnam desde la perspectiva de una significativa cantidad de personas que estuvieron allÃ, de sus testimonios y vivencias, para ofrecer, como indica el subtÃtulo de la obra, “una historia oralâ€�.
¿Quiere saber más de este libro, sin spoilers? Visite:
Género. Historia.
Lo que nos cuenta. Historia de la Guerra de Vietnam desde la perspectiva de una significativa cantidad de personas que estuvieron allÃ, de sus testimonios y vivencias, para ofrecer, como indica el subtÃtulo de la obra, “una historia oralâ€�.
¿Quiere saber más de este libro, sin spoilers? Visite:
June 22, 2013
This book is really heavy, for it contains not only accounts of the war, but it contains the views of the war. And it is views that we struggle the most to understand, to agree or disagree, to sympathize or to feel indifferent, to admire or to hate. Throughout the book, I have all kinds of emotions. What surprises me is that I am very easy to be moved, but difficult to be angered. This book perhaps has that kind of effect on me, I accept that we're so diverse and different as humans.
I appreciate how the author incorporates stories from all kinds of people to the war, on both sides, of course. There are Vietnamese and Americans, there are North and South Vietnam, there are pro and antiwar. Not so perfectly balanced, but the book to me seems to be a miniature of life, with voices from everywhere. A great part of the book tries to show how the war affected the whole society in US, not just the people directly engaged in combats. Perhaps not all is so-called "traumatized" by the past, but the war certainly leaves its mark on everyone. I am aware of the lack and limit of sources on the Vietnam's side, but all stories are valuable anyway. Still, there is a certain reluctance on the Vietnam's side, as people do not so easily pour out their hearts and thoughts, compared to what I sometimes find in the accounts of some Americans. It's culture, maybe, or it's political, probably, or both.
What is so scary is that history seems to drift away. I don't want us to be obsessed by the past. But there are so many things, so many things to be learnt, to be felt, to be understood. And surely there are still so many things uncovered. Please read the past, please remember that we're rightful and unjust, we're amiable and monstrous, we're idealistic and disillusioned, please remember that right and wrong is so hard to draw a line, please accept who we are. Because only when we accept who we are can we move forward. Ignoring the past will only make us to return to the starting line, and learn everything, bitterly, all over again.
I appreciate how the author incorporates stories from all kinds of people to the war, on both sides, of course. There are Vietnamese and Americans, there are North and South Vietnam, there are pro and antiwar. Not so perfectly balanced, but the book to me seems to be a miniature of life, with voices from everywhere. A great part of the book tries to show how the war affected the whole society in US, not just the people directly engaged in combats. Perhaps not all is so-called "traumatized" by the past, but the war certainly leaves its mark on everyone. I am aware of the lack and limit of sources on the Vietnam's side, but all stories are valuable anyway. Still, there is a certain reluctance on the Vietnam's side, as people do not so easily pour out their hearts and thoughts, compared to what I sometimes find in the accounts of some Americans. It's culture, maybe, or it's political, probably, or both.
What is so scary is that history seems to drift away. I don't want us to be obsessed by the past. But there are so many things, so many things to be learnt, to be felt, to be understood. And surely there are still so many things uncovered. Please read the past, please remember that we're rightful and unjust, we're amiable and monstrous, we're idealistic and disillusioned, please remember that right and wrong is so hard to draw a line, please accept who we are. Because only when we accept who we are can we move forward. Ignoring the past will only make us to return to the starting line, and learn everything, bitterly, all over again.
December 9, 2015
I like oral histories of important periods of the past. I like that they are the assembled verbal recollections of individuals whose experiences reflect a part of the event. Accumulated, they form a comprehensive history. I like that their memories are honestly told and for that reason can be considered a truth, no matter if accounts sometimes differ. I've read some oral histories I thought were excellent records. Christian G. Appy's Patriots is perhaps the finest example I know of this method of history. Most oral histories tell only one side. Appy's approach, as his title indicates, is to tell the story "from all sides" and the result is epic, accomplished. He's interviewed every level of those who served during the Vietnam years, from military leaders and policymakers to people who saw the war as children. Former Viet Cong soldiers, underground operatives, and even porters along the Ho Chi Minh Trail are given as equal say by Appy as American GIs and ARVN soldiers who fought near their homes and families. The Vietnam Era was divisive in both Vietnamese and American societies, but especially for us. Those who think we should have prosecuted the war more aggressively and fought to win at any cost are heard as loudly as those who protested in the streets or went to Canada or Sweden. The testimonies of medical personnel, whether a doctor from the North who operated in Cambodian tunnels or an American nurse, are emotionally wrenching. One of the most poignant memories is that of an airline stewardess who flew the route between America and Saigon taking nervous soldiers from the world into the war and then back. Those who recorded the war, either as combat artists or journalists on the spot or novelists and poets reflecting later, are included. Told "from all sides," American and Vietnamese, what binds them together, as Appy saw from the start, is a common humanity and shared experience.
The accounts are arranged chronologically from the 1940s to the defeat of the South in 1975. Even beyond, actually. A few who were children during the war speak of the legacy of those years growing up in America or Vietnam.
Ultimately, this is a terribly sad book. Individuals holding every possible attitude toward the war are allowed to speak. However, most remember with regret. Appy himself provides the introductory material for each section. His treatment is that Vietnam was a tragedy, and that point of view flows through the book from the words of Ta Quang Thinh, a disabled North Vietnamese soldier who speaks early in the book from Hanoi to William Westmoreland who speaks near the end from Charleston, South Carolina. I've read a lot of books about Vietnam, but this long ribbon of voices taught me a lot I didn't know, taught me new ways to see.
The accounts are arranged chronologically from the 1940s to the defeat of the South in 1975. Even beyond, actually. A few who were children during the war speak of the legacy of those years growing up in America or Vietnam.
Ultimately, this is a terribly sad book. Individuals holding every possible attitude toward the war are allowed to speak. However, most remember with regret. Appy himself provides the introductory material for each section. His treatment is that Vietnam was a tragedy, and that point of view flows through the book from the words of Ta Quang Thinh, a disabled North Vietnamese soldier who speaks early in the book from Hanoi to William Westmoreland who speaks near the end from Charleston, South Carolina. I've read a lot of books about Vietnam, but this long ribbon of voices taught me a lot I didn't know, taught me new ways to see.
January 19, 2021
When Christian Appy's epic work came out in 2003- it was something new. Where most oral histories of the war focused on one side, usually the Americans, and often on one aspect of the war, Helicopter or Riverine warfare for instance- Appy takes it all on. From all three sides, Communist and non-Communist Vietnamese, and the American interlopers who came to take part. The result is a towering 550 page work- discussing all aspects of the war- from all aspects. With this format, you can't spend too much time on any one part of the war- but can get get up close with a lot of different experiences- and getting the memories from opposing combatants can give a lot of perspective. I really enjoyed it - even as I read some really anguishing memories- because I learned new things about a conflict that I've already read a lot about. Appy covers the civilian wars in Country and in North America, and the POW/MIA war so you really get a feel for the era.
There are Memories of the Famous , figures like Walt Rostow, Daniel Ellsberg and General Westmoreland, who planned and managed the war. But the real meat of the book is interviews with regular Officers and Men, Marines and Soldiers, Pilots and Sailors, Viet Cong and NVA, RVN soldiers and bureaucrats, City and Rural civilians, POWs and Captors, Anti War Protestors and Pro War Advocates- whenever you get one side, you are likely to get at least one opposing view. It's not perfect, I might have liked another few voices in the mix- but its really good. I think its mixed up enough that any reader can learn from it - you don't have to a Military History buff.
This is a very real book with a LOT of adult themes, and a lot of graphic passages, so this is best read by the Junior reader over about 14 years. For the Gamer/Modeler/Military Enthusiast, this is a real resource. Only about a quarter of the stories translate into possible scenario/diorama ideas- but those that do are pretty vivid. The content on the Vietnamese combatants is really interesting- as we don't get much of that translated for us. And there are some interesting stories from parts of the Military you don't tend to hear from- logistical guys tending not to write books of their experiences- but getting to tell their stories here. It's not a required Wargame/Modeller/Enthusiast book- but a really nice extra resource to give your comprehension of the conflict some depth. And for the more casual reader- a wonderful way to get acquainted with the Issues of the war through the people that lived them. If you are writing an essay- and you need a lot of different perspectives in one place - this book is gold. A Strong Rec.
There are Memories of the Famous , figures like Walt Rostow, Daniel Ellsberg and General Westmoreland, who planned and managed the war. But the real meat of the book is interviews with regular Officers and Men, Marines and Soldiers, Pilots and Sailors, Viet Cong and NVA, RVN soldiers and bureaucrats, City and Rural civilians, POWs and Captors, Anti War Protestors and Pro War Advocates- whenever you get one side, you are likely to get at least one opposing view. It's not perfect, I might have liked another few voices in the mix- but its really good. I think its mixed up enough that any reader can learn from it - you don't have to a Military History buff.
This is a very real book with a LOT of adult themes, and a lot of graphic passages, so this is best read by the Junior reader over about 14 years. For the Gamer/Modeler/Military Enthusiast, this is a real resource. Only about a quarter of the stories translate into possible scenario/diorama ideas- but those that do are pretty vivid. The content on the Vietnamese combatants is really interesting- as we don't get much of that translated for us. And there are some interesting stories from parts of the Military you don't tend to hear from- logistical guys tending not to write books of their experiences- but getting to tell their stories here. It's not a required Wargame/Modeller/Enthusiast book- but a really nice extra resource to give your comprehension of the conflict some depth. And for the more casual reader- a wonderful way to get acquainted with the Issues of the war through the people that lived them. If you are writing an essay- and you need a lot of different perspectives in one place - this book is gold. A Strong Rec.
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November 21, 2021I've come to the conclusion that war is what oral history does best -- I mean, I guess that's why that zombie book did so well. And Patriots is no exception. Ever since I watched and was rather disappointed by Ken Burns' Vietnam documentary (when it's funded by the Koch Foundation, you can expect some... elisions), I've become increasingly interested in the war. I know I had family that was there, but none close enough to casually call out of the blue to chat about Khe Sanh with, so this is as close as I'm gonna get. And I've been to Vietnam, seen the scars and the horrors, but there the narrative is very much onward-and-upward, and the Vietnamese have been awfully good at moving onward and upward. But that doesn't teach me a lot.
So it's nice to hear the plurality of voices, some of them absolutely fucking insane (hi there, Westmoreland!), although I'm a bit disappointed that McNamara and the ol' piece o' shit gang didn't show up in force. Honestly, skip the Burns doc and just read this.
So it's nice to hear the plurality of voices, some of them absolutely fucking insane (hi there, Westmoreland!), although I'm a bit disappointed that McNamara and the ol' piece o' shit gang didn't show up in force. Honestly, skip the Burns doc and just read this.
August 10, 2018
La guerra de Vietnam es tal vez uno de los conflictos armados más iconográficos de la historia humana. La propia palabra “Vietnamâ€� antes de traernos a la mente un paÃs, nos retrotrae a imágenes de soldados desaliñados y medio hippies fumando en medio de la selva mientras cargan M16 o pesadas M60, bombardeos de napalm, delgados soldados del Vietcong marchando al ritmo de cánticos al “TÃo Hoâ€� y decenas de helicópteros en formación sobrevolando hectáreas infinitas de selva con el sol poniente a cuestas mientras suena de fondo música de Bob Dylan, The Animals, Jimi Hendrix, Creedence Clearwater Revival o James Brown. Pese a todas las imágenes vinculadas a dicha contienda, resulta paradójico que pocos son los que tienen plena certeza de las causas, los orÃgenes y el desarrollo de una guerra cuyo génesis se diluye en el tiempo.
Vietnam fue un conflicto que no se pareció ni se parecerá a ningún otro. Hija de su época, todo el espÃritu de los 60 y mitad de los 70 está condensado en una batalla que se extendió por más de dos décadas, enfrentando a la súper potencia económica y militar de la época contra simples guerrilleros y nacionalistas, pertrechados por el otro bando de la guerra frÃa, pero armados de coraje y ciego deseo por mantener la independencia y unidad de su paÃs. En un contexto tan complejo, es difÃcil escribir sobre la totalidad de una contienda tan enrevesada sin caer en juicios de valor puramente subjetivos sobre las apologÃas, decisiones y polÃticas que llevaron a una conflagración cruenta, absurda e inmoral; o necesaria e imprescindible para defender los valores democráticos, todo de acuerdo a la orilla en la que se pose quien escriba sobre ella.
LlegarÃa pues el señor Christian G. Appy, un doctor en historia de la Universidad de Harvard y experto en historia de Norteamérica y sobre la guerra de Vietnam, quien se lanzarÃa al ruedo al iniciar un difÃcil cruzada tratando de relatar y a su vez, explicar la contienda de Vietnam desde sus mismÃsimos orÃgenes con el coletazo final de Francia por preservar su colonia de Indochina luego de la Segunda Guerra Mundial, hasta la caÃda final de Saigón en 1975. Para ello Appy se encarga de contarnos acerca de Vietnam, no desde sus propios estudios y conclusiones, sino desde los testimonios de cientos de combatientes, diplomáticos, comandantes, agentes de los gobiernos, artistas y una cantidad ingente de protagonistas que participaron directa o indirectamente en el conflicto desde sus inicios, pasando por su escalada, su intensificación hasta su caótico desenlace. Las palabras del autor sólo se pueden apreciar a modo de introducción contextual histórica en cada uno de los capÃtulos para luego dar rienda suelta a la intensidad y fuerza del libro, la cual radica en el modo en el que sus protagonistas relatan en primera persona sobre sus propias experiencias en la guerra.
El gran acierto del texto radica en la calidad de los testimonios y la forma como el autor los organizó, no sólo de manera cronológica sino también con el perfecto equilibrio para que tanto polÃticos y soldados norteamericanos proguerra, fundadores y miembros de los grupos antibelicistas, soldados survietnamitas, combatientes del Vietcong e integrantes del politburó del norte de Vietnam; expresen sus vivencias y sentimientos acerca del conflicto, permitiendo al lector sentarse en la postura polÃtica y moral que a bien considere.
La guerra de Vietnam es ya un mito, alimentado gracias al cine y la televisión de los años ochenta. (Y debe serlo, si hasta Rambo y Los MagnÃficos [A-Team ] estuvieron en Vietnam). De pelÃculas como “Apocalypse Nowâ€�, “Full Metal Jacketâ€� o “Platoonâ€� nos queda el lado –parcializado- de la historia norteamericana, pero siempre se echan de menos relatos del otro bando - como curiosidad histórica â€� del bando que de cierta manera, ganó la contienda. Es difÃcil calificar un libro como “definitivoâ€�, pero sà hay alguno que quiebre los mitos de Vietnam, cuente sus orÃgenes y extraños desarrollos y desenlaces, y a la vez, nos ponga en el contexto real del conflicto casi que en primera lÃnea de batalla, es sin lugar a dudas, este libro cuyo tÃtulo “Una historia Oralâ€� es más que perfecto.
Vietnam fue un conflicto que no se pareció ni se parecerá a ningún otro. Hija de su época, todo el espÃritu de los 60 y mitad de los 70 está condensado en una batalla que se extendió por más de dos décadas, enfrentando a la súper potencia económica y militar de la época contra simples guerrilleros y nacionalistas, pertrechados por el otro bando de la guerra frÃa, pero armados de coraje y ciego deseo por mantener la independencia y unidad de su paÃs. En un contexto tan complejo, es difÃcil escribir sobre la totalidad de una contienda tan enrevesada sin caer en juicios de valor puramente subjetivos sobre las apologÃas, decisiones y polÃticas que llevaron a una conflagración cruenta, absurda e inmoral; o necesaria e imprescindible para defender los valores democráticos, todo de acuerdo a la orilla en la que se pose quien escriba sobre ella.
LlegarÃa pues el señor Christian G. Appy, un doctor en historia de la Universidad de Harvard y experto en historia de Norteamérica y sobre la guerra de Vietnam, quien se lanzarÃa al ruedo al iniciar un difÃcil cruzada tratando de relatar y a su vez, explicar la contienda de Vietnam desde sus mismÃsimos orÃgenes con el coletazo final de Francia por preservar su colonia de Indochina luego de la Segunda Guerra Mundial, hasta la caÃda final de Saigón en 1975. Para ello Appy se encarga de contarnos acerca de Vietnam, no desde sus propios estudios y conclusiones, sino desde los testimonios de cientos de combatientes, diplomáticos, comandantes, agentes de los gobiernos, artistas y una cantidad ingente de protagonistas que participaron directa o indirectamente en el conflicto desde sus inicios, pasando por su escalada, su intensificación hasta su caótico desenlace. Las palabras del autor sólo se pueden apreciar a modo de introducción contextual histórica en cada uno de los capÃtulos para luego dar rienda suelta a la intensidad y fuerza del libro, la cual radica en el modo en el que sus protagonistas relatan en primera persona sobre sus propias experiencias en la guerra.
El gran acierto del texto radica en la calidad de los testimonios y la forma como el autor los organizó, no sólo de manera cronológica sino también con el perfecto equilibrio para que tanto polÃticos y soldados norteamericanos proguerra, fundadores y miembros de los grupos antibelicistas, soldados survietnamitas, combatientes del Vietcong e integrantes del politburó del norte de Vietnam; expresen sus vivencias y sentimientos acerca del conflicto, permitiendo al lector sentarse en la postura polÃtica y moral que a bien considere.
La guerra de Vietnam es ya un mito, alimentado gracias al cine y la televisión de los años ochenta. (Y debe serlo, si hasta Rambo y Los MagnÃficos [A-Team ] estuvieron en Vietnam). De pelÃculas como “Apocalypse Nowâ€�, “Full Metal Jacketâ€� o “Platoonâ€� nos queda el lado –parcializado- de la historia norteamericana, pero siempre se echan de menos relatos del otro bando - como curiosidad histórica â€� del bando que de cierta manera, ganó la contienda. Es difÃcil calificar un libro como “definitivoâ€�, pero sà hay alguno que quiebre los mitos de Vietnam, cuente sus orÃgenes y extraños desarrollos y desenlaces, y a la vez, nos ponga en el contexto real del conflicto casi que en primera lÃnea de batalla, es sin lugar a dudas, este libro cuyo tÃtulo “Una historia Oralâ€� es más que perfecto.
February 5, 2017
Habiendo nacido a principio de los 80's las ideas que tenÃa de la guerra fueron el resultado de la visión de Hollywood. PelÃculas como Platoon, Born on the Fourth of July, Apocalypze Now, Casualties of War, y otras no tan serias como Missing in Action, Rambo, etc.
La idea que tenÃa era de una guerra entre vietnamitas y norteamericanos. Donde los segundos invadieron para contener el avance de las revoluciones comunistas, con la presunción de que si no frenaban éstas donde sea que ocurriesen se producirÃa un efecto dominó y caerÃan un paÃs tras otro. Otra idea es que Vietnam del norte era un tÃtere de Rusia o China (o ambos).
Este libro ahonda en varios aspectos que me permitieron derribar estos mitos, y ver el conflictos desde diversos ángulos, tanto militares, como polÃticos.
SabÃa del movimiento antibélico en los EE.UU. durante el conflicto, pero no tenÃa idea de la dimensión, ni del apoyo real que tenÃa en la población.
El libro es completo, ya que brinda testimonios de primera mano de personas que participaron de formas diversas... PolÃticos, lÃderes militares, soldados, periodistas, artistas y "gente común" de ambos bandos aportan su testimonio.
La idea que tenÃa era de una guerra entre vietnamitas y norteamericanos. Donde los segundos invadieron para contener el avance de las revoluciones comunistas, con la presunción de que si no frenaban éstas donde sea que ocurriesen se producirÃa un efecto dominó y caerÃan un paÃs tras otro. Otra idea es que Vietnam del norte era un tÃtere de Rusia o China (o ambos).
Este libro ahonda en varios aspectos que me permitieron derribar estos mitos, y ver el conflictos desde diversos ángulos, tanto militares, como polÃticos.
SabÃa del movimiento antibélico en los EE.UU. durante el conflicto, pero no tenÃa idea de la dimensión, ni del apoyo real que tenÃa en la población.
El libro es completo, ya que brinda testimonios de primera mano de personas que participaron de formas diversas... PolÃticos, lÃderes militares, soldados, periodistas, artistas y "gente común" de ambos bandos aportan su testimonio.
March 31, 2019
Very eye opening book, gives consideration to both sides of the conflict in its wordings. Gives a ground-level view on what war means to the average person, plenty of stories from those embedded in the conflicts, on both sides, I like how the book crosses through the years from the 1940s to the 1970s, I like how different opinions and different views are absorbed into the book. Reading this book gives you a great understanding of the Vietnam war. For people interested in the Vietnam War, that read this type of book, this would be a great supplement to other books about Vietnam War that you read. Well written, well documented. Did not find any editorial faults. Would be a good source of information for History Students at College or University.
January 31, 2025
Absolutely one of the best books about Vietnam I've ever read and I've read quite a few. The first-person perspective came from every possible direction there is. I really enjoyed all the different and constantly changing insights into this tragic war. It's a hard book to put down and it will really help you understand this very complex conflict. It makes you wish you could go back to the near beginning of this conflict and change the course of history before this unnecessary war started. I'd recommend this book to anyone who's interested in the Vietnam War.
March 5, 2021
Una visión muy extensa, precisa y diversa, a traves de entrevistas. El libro más neutral q he leÃdo hasta ahora sobre esa guerra.
December 19, 2008
Vietnam is a country that was almost always at war, for the first 75 years of the 20th Century. They fought a French, a Japanese, and then another French occupation. Millions died before the American portion of the war began. As you may imagine, many Vietnamese saw the American prescence as another foreign occupation. America was still traumatized by the Communist takeover in China, and most Americans saw Vietnam as just another Communist domino.
During the American portion of the Vietnam War, 3 million people died. That included 58,000 American soldiers, 224,000 South Vietnamese troops, 1.1 million Communist troops, and civilians made up most of the remainder. In the United States, eight Americans burned themselves to death, to protest the war. Four protestors were shot dead at Kent State.
Three times as many American bombs were dropped on Vietnam, Laos, and Cambodia than during the entire Second World War, and millions of acres of forest were destroyed by chemicals like Agent Orange. American soldiers had a very difficult time differentiating between the enemy and noncombatants. In 1968, American Soldiers killed 500 unarmed Vietnamese woman and children, during the My Lai Massacre. The Free-Fire Zone tactic consisted of Americans telling everyone to leave a given area. After a certain amount of time, anyone remaining was fair game. More than 5 million people were forcibly removed from their homes, due to such a tactic. The Phoenix Program allowed for the assasination of anyone blamed as being a Communist, and the program killed tens of thousands. The North Vietnamese certainly were not saints in the war either. One theme of this book is that dehumanization is a part of war. When dehumanization occurs, then horrible things can and are justified against the opposing side.
For people who did not live during the height of the Cold War, the Vietnam War does not seem to make much sense at all.
Hundreds of individuals were interviewed in this book. They were from both sides, and they were in quite a variety of different occupations. The one thing that most of them had in common was that they were just doing their job, even though they didn't always agree with it. Similar social, political, and ethical situations remain today.
This book did a great job describing the many faces of the Vietnam War. The only thing that I did not like about it was that there was no censorship of language. Ex-veterans and hippies can use colorful words. Otherwise, I would have given this book a five.
During the American portion of the Vietnam War, 3 million people died. That included 58,000 American soldiers, 224,000 South Vietnamese troops, 1.1 million Communist troops, and civilians made up most of the remainder. In the United States, eight Americans burned themselves to death, to protest the war. Four protestors were shot dead at Kent State.
Three times as many American bombs were dropped on Vietnam, Laos, and Cambodia than during the entire Second World War, and millions of acres of forest were destroyed by chemicals like Agent Orange. American soldiers had a very difficult time differentiating between the enemy and noncombatants. In 1968, American Soldiers killed 500 unarmed Vietnamese woman and children, during the My Lai Massacre. The Free-Fire Zone tactic consisted of Americans telling everyone to leave a given area. After a certain amount of time, anyone remaining was fair game. More than 5 million people were forcibly removed from their homes, due to such a tactic. The Phoenix Program allowed for the assasination of anyone blamed as being a Communist, and the program killed tens of thousands. The North Vietnamese certainly were not saints in the war either. One theme of this book is that dehumanization is a part of war. When dehumanization occurs, then horrible things can and are justified against the opposing side.
For people who did not live during the height of the Cold War, the Vietnam War does not seem to make much sense at all.
Hundreds of individuals were interviewed in this book. They were from both sides, and they were in quite a variety of different occupations. The one thing that most of them had in common was that they were just doing their job, even though they didn't always agree with it. Similar social, political, and ethical situations remain today.
This book did a great job describing the many faces of the Vietnam War. The only thing that I did not like about it was that there was no censorship of language. Ex-veterans and hippies can use colorful words. Otherwise, I would have given this book a five.
July 5, 2017
This book is essential to anyone who is interested in the Vietnam war, regardless of how much they know prior to reading it. Each section of the book is introduced with a few paragraphs about a certain aspect of the war or the time period that is covered in the next batch of interviews. Although they are brief, these sections are helpful in understanding the interviews themselves.
I finished the book a few weeks ago and many of these stories are still very vivid in my mind. I marked many of the more noteworthy interviews to go back to in the future. A lot of these interviews are brief enough that they can be read in 5-10 minutes, which I feel is a real strength of the book.
This book contains a remarkable range of people who were involved in the war, either directly or indirectly. Soldiers, officers, poets, refugees, nurses, doctors, USO show performers, protesters, riot police, civil rights activists, politicians, POWs, POW families, pilots, 1st generation Vietnamese immigrants to the US and more are given a chance to share their stories and it is truly fascinating. I have read many fiction and non-fiction books on the Vietnam war, my favorite being Matterhorn by Karl Marlantes, but now that I have finished this book I hold it up as the true standard on the topic.
I only have a few nitpicks with this book, but they are minor and did not diminish my opinion of the book. First, I was disappointed with General Westmoreland's interview towards the end of the book. I understand this is an oral history and it is up to the subjects and not the author/compiler to create the content of the interviews, but General Westmoreland's interview was so brief and basic that it felt like a major missed opportunity.
I would have appreciated interviews with more of the international communities and forces involved in the war, particularly the Australians and New Zealanders. It would have been nice to hear from the French as well, given their role in the area prior to the American war.
My other nitpick is that there was no mention of the "tunnel-rat" aspect of combat. I feel an interview with a soldier or marine who had to go through that harrowing ordeal, which in my limited knowledge appears to be unique in American combat history to this war, would have been fascinating.
It is a remarkable feat to pack such nuance and depth into a book made up of generally brief monologues, and this book succeeds admirably. This is a thoughtful book that packs an emotional punch, while being highly educational and easily accessible. Highly recommended.
I finished the book a few weeks ago and many of these stories are still very vivid in my mind. I marked many of the more noteworthy interviews to go back to in the future. A lot of these interviews are brief enough that they can be read in 5-10 minutes, which I feel is a real strength of the book.
This book contains a remarkable range of people who were involved in the war, either directly or indirectly. Soldiers, officers, poets, refugees, nurses, doctors, USO show performers, protesters, riot police, civil rights activists, politicians, POWs, POW families, pilots, 1st generation Vietnamese immigrants to the US and more are given a chance to share their stories and it is truly fascinating. I have read many fiction and non-fiction books on the Vietnam war, my favorite being Matterhorn by Karl Marlantes, but now that I have finished this book I hold it up as the true standard on the topic.
I only have a few nitpicks with this book, but they are minor and did not diminish my opinion of the book. First, I was disappointed with General Westmoreland's interview towards the end of the book. I understand this is an oral history and it is up to the subjects and not the author/compiler to create the content of the interviews, but General Westmoreland's interview was so brief and basic that it felt like a major missed opportunity.
I would have appreciated interviews with more of the international communities and forces involved in the war, particularly the Australians and New Zealanders. It would have been nice to hear from the French as well, given their role in the area prior to the American war.
My other nitpick is that there was no mention of the "tunnel-rat" aspect of combat. I feel an interview with a soldier or marine who had to go through that harrowing ordeal, which in my limited knowledge appears to be unique in American combat history to this war, would have been fascinating.
It is a remarkable feat to pack such nuance and depth into a book made up of generally brief monologues, and this book succeeds admirably. This is a thoughtful book that packs an emotional punch, while being highly educational and easily accessible. Highly recommended.
October 24, 2018
As somebody who knew next to nothing about Vietnam, I found this book enormously useful. What I know best about it are the famous photographs, reproduced so many times as to lose meaning or to convey the wrong one:
- the Vietnamese guy shooting a Viet Cong wearing a checkered shirt? He was a general, executing a spy who had just killed soldiers under his command
- children running naked? The napalm was dropped by South Vietnamese
- piles of civilian bodies, inclusive of babies? The My Lai massacre, for which the GIs were never really punished
In short, after the WWII the French were forced out of Vietnam, but the Americans enforced splitting the county in two (following the infamous Korean model) because they were paranoid about Communism.
Vietnam could have united from 1954, but despite the Cold War being very much in the air, the Vietnamese failed to make clear they were not a Russian or Chinese paw and they were planning to create a cozy, independent Communist state of their own. However, during the war they had no qualms using military and financial support from both Communist super-powers.
Even in the North, many Vietnamese were not enthusiastic about loosing their land to a Communist regime, the South was a mess and what developed was basically a civil war, intruded upon (and instigated) by the American - who definitely should have stayed out of it.
High ranking Americans knew the "war" was lost from very early on, but they continued to send troops not to "loose face". The North Vietnamese were fanatically brainwashed into fighting forever and the South Vietnamese were lost in between.
The “w²¹°ùâ€� itself was an endless series of inconclusive missions and bombings that caused enormous casualties. If anything can make you lose faith in humankind, it is this whole senseless "war" that lasted some twenty years and left EVERYBODY involved permanently scarred.
Interesting to know, when the South fell, the Communist implemented a programme of "re-education", slightly less severe than in Cambodia and sent hundreds of their countrymen to work in agricultural projects, to break their bodies and spirit and "convince them" that Communism was the only way to go.
The victorious, Communist Vietnam did not work out so well, but it is not the sort of story that makes headlines like American bombings...
- the Vietnamese guy shooting a Viet Cong wearing a checkered shirt? He was a general, executing a spy who had just killed soldiers under his command
- children running naked? The napalm was dropped by South Vietnamese
- piles of civilian bodies, inclusive of babies? The My Lai massacre, for which the GIs were never really punished
In short, after the WWII the French were forced out of Vietnam, but the Americans enforced splitting the county in two (following the infamous Korean model) because they were paranoid about Communism.
Vietnam could have united from 1954, but despite the Cold War being very much in the air, the Vietnamese failed to make clear they were not a Russian or Chinese paw and they were planning to create a cozy, independent Communist state of their own. However, during the war they had no qualms using military and financial support from both Communist super-powers.
Even in the North, many Vietnamese were not enthusiastic about loosing their land to a Communist regime, the South was a mess and what developed was basically a civil war, intruded upon (and instigated) by the American - who definitely should have stayed out of it.
High ranking Americans knew the "war" was lost from very early on, but they continued to send troops not to "loose face". The North Vietnamese were fanatically brainwashed into fighting forever and the South Vietnamese were lost in between.
The “w²¹°ùâ€� itself was an endless series of inconclusive missions and bombings that caused enormous casualties. If anything can make you lose faith in humankind, it is this whole senseless "war" that lasted some twenty years and left EVERYBODY involved permanently scarred.
Interesting to know, when the South fell, the Communist implemented a programme of "re-education", slightly less severe than in Cambodia and sent hundreds of their countrymen to work in agricultural projects, to break their bodies and spirit and "convince them" that Communism was the only way to go.
The victorious, Communist Vietnam did not work out so well, but it is not the sort of story that makes headlines like American bombings...
April 26, 2024
This is a very fine, indeed excellent history, but it is despite the collection of voices from all sides a history about America's involvement in Vietnam and aimed at American readers. This is hardly surprising almost all books on the Vietnam War in English, whether fiction or nonfiction, viewed and reported that conflict through the prism of American involvement. I do not excuse myself from this skewered perspective and will admit that it was only after reading Viet Thanh Nguyen's 'The Sympathiser' that I blinkered my view of this war was because when I had thought of the Vietnamese story it was only of the North Vietnamese. The South Vietnamese, the people for whom the war was fought and who fought and died in vast numbers in that war had never entered my thoughts.
None of this is to criticise this particular book but to emphasise that we, those in the USA and the West, need to move on from viewing of Vietnam through our eyes and perspectives (though actually understanding the post WWII roots of the conflict would also help Fredrik Logevall's 'Embers of War' is excellent but there are many others) and thinking about it as a war of the Vietnamese people. The involvement of France, the USA and even Australia (talk about being forgotten! how many reading this knew that 60,000 Australians fought in Vietnam that 523 died and 2,400 were wounded?) had long term repercussions for them outside of what their involvement meant for Vietnam. But it is a Vietnamese story first and it is about time we free ourselves of our mental blinkers.
Still this is a fascinating book, though like all oral histories at its best it tells you what people thought at the time. Of course all memory is flawed and retrospectively we rearrange, reinterpret and refine our memories. More importantly, oral history is not necessarily an accurate history. Books like this tell a truth, but a fractured truth, and while all history may be partial an oral history can be mendacious in fact but honest in reporting what people thought.
None of this is to criticise this particular book but to emphasise that we, those in the USA and the West, need to move on from viewing of Vietnam through our eyes and perspectives (though actually understanding the post WWII roots of the conflict would also help Fredrik Logevall's 'Embers of War' is excellent but there are many others) and thinking about it as a war of the Vietnamese people. The involvement of France, the USA and even Australia (talk about being forgotten! how many reading this knew that 60,000 Australians fought in Vietnam that 523 died and 2,400 were wounded?) had long term repercussions for them outside of what their involvement meant for Vietnam. But it is a Vietnamese story first and it is about time we free ourselves of our mental blinkers.
Still this is a fascinating book, though like all oral histories at its best it tells you what people thought at the time. Of course all memory is flawed and retrospectively we rearrange, reinterpret and refine our memories. More importantly, oral history is not necessarily an accurate history. Books like this tell a truth, but a fractured truth, and while all history may be partial an oral history can be mendacious in fact but honest in reporting what people thought.
February 21, 2017
One of the best historical accounts of a war I've ever read. In a unique format, Appy lifts the lid on the story of the Vietnam War from both sides of the conflict. He does this through intelligently selected first hand accounts from not only the top advisers and generals of the war, but also the common soldiers, doctors and nurses and children who bore the brunt of the wartime sacrifices.
After completing the book, I was left with a sense of how wrong this war was and how little we are taught in school about one of America's biggest blunders. In the big picture, stopping the spread of communism and the adherence to the domino theory sounded like a admirable cause but once the tragic stories of the Vietnamese people are exposed, there is little justification for such a brutal war. And it truly was a brutal war. From the constant day and night bombings from the US Air force and Navy to the incentavized patrol mission of killing as many Vietnamese as possible, regardless if they were military or not, the war made many young, American soldiers do things and act in ways that horrify them to this day. From the "good war" that was World War II, we were taught to glorify war, love John Wayne, and never question gods purpose of spreading democracy.
Over 10 years of conflict, the war soon turned massively unpopular for the civilians back home but also for the soldiers at the front. Pep talks were frequently needed, officers were beat up by their own soldiers, and 34% of soldiers were using heroin in 1970. When Nixon won the presidency in 1968, he had a two part strategy of building up SV army while reducing the number of American troops and also bombing Cambodia and Laos so they wouldn't harbor Vietcong.
Overall a very interesting book that prepared me for my own trip through Vietnam.
After completing the book, I was left with a sense of how wrong this war was and how little we are taught in school about one of America's biggest blunders. In the big picture, stopping the spread of communism and the adherence to the domino theory sounded like a admirable cause but once the tragic stories of the Vietnamese people are exposed, there is little justification for such a brutal war. And it truly was a brutal war. From the constant day and night bombings from the US Air force and Navy to the incentavized patrol mission of killing as many Vietnamese as possible, regardless if they were military or not, the war made many young, American soldiers do things and act in ways that horrify them to this day. From the "good war" that was World War II, we were taught to glorify war, love John Wayne, and never question gods purpose of spreading democracy.
Over 10 years of conflict, the war soon turned massively unpopular for the civilians back home but also for the soldiers at the front. Pep talks were frequently needed, officers were beat up by their own soldiers, and 34% of soldiers were using heroin in 1970. When Nixon won the presidency in 1968, he had a two part strategy of building up SV army while reducing the number of American troops and also bombing Cambodia and Laos so they wouldn't harbor Vietcong.
Overall a very interesting book that prepared me for my own trip through Vietnam.
This entire review has been hidden because of spoilers.
May 7, 2018
"From all sides" indeed!
Patriots is a collection (some 600 pages long) of distilled interviews - there must be hundreds of them - with people who, in some manner, experienced the Vietnam War. There are American and Vietnamese soldiers, of course, but also nurses, doctors, medics, draft evaders, generals, politicians, anti-war activists, refugees... there is the child wounded in Vietnam and sent to the US to be treated and ultimately, to live; there is the wife of the Quaker man who burned himself to death in front of the Pentagon to protest the war; there is General Westmoreland; there is a pair of brothers, one of whom served in Vietnam and one of whom went to Canada - and the story of how they remained close throughout it all; there is the artist "embedded" with North Vietnamese troops, charged with keeping up morale, who drew pictures using saliva mixed with dirt when he ran out of pencils; and there's the family split for the duration, with mom becoming a military doctor, dad serving in the North Vietnamese Army elsewhere, and children living in the countryside outside of Hanoi, to escape the bombing. There is even a stewardess who worked on the commercial planes that brought GIs to the war and home again.
This book is almost too big to take in, but it is certainly an amazing piece of work and an important document.
Patriots is a collection (some 600 pages long) of distilled interviews - there must be hundreds of them - with people who, in some manner, experienced the Vietnam War. There are American and Vietnamese soldiers, of course, but also nurses, doctors, medics, draft evaders, generals, politicians, anti-war activists, refugees... there is the child wounded in Vietnam and sent to the US to be treated and ultimately, to live; there is the wife of the Quaker man who burned himself to death in front of the Pentagon to protest the war; there is General Westmoreland; there is a pair of brothers, one of whom served in Vietnam and one of whom went to Canada - and the story of how they remained close throughout it all; there is the artist "embedded" with North Vietnamese troops, charged with keeping up morale, who drew pictures using saliva mixed with dirt when he ran out of pencils; and there's the family split for the duration, with mom becoming a military doctor, dad serving in the North Vietnamese Army elsewhere, and children living in the countryside outside of Hanoi, to escape the bombing. There is even a stewardess who worked on the commercial planes that brought GIs to the war and home again.
This book is almost too big to take in, but it is certainly an amazing piece of work and an important document.
September 9, 2016
Although learning in classes and seeing artifacts of the Vietnam teaches you about the conflict, often information is missing or only partially shown. In by Christian G. Apply, perspectives from all walks of life are explored. This is perhaps my favorite aspect of the book, with it traveling from a ARVN perspective to that of an American nurse, or OSS advisors who met Ho Chi Minh before the formation of independent Viietnams. The book gave me outlooks I never would have thought of otherwise, and introduced me to parts of the war I had never even considered. It also gave insight into many of the thoughts of major individuals, why they did what they did, and how the war changed them afterward. In an era where Vietnam is often skewed by groups such as Hollywood, I could not recommend this book more as a research into the players as well as the daily life of those participating in the Vietnam War.
This entire review has been hidden because of spoilers.
July 27, 2015
Patriots is hands-down the best book on the Vietnam War I have read. And I have read quite a few. Rather than being a work of literature, a nonfiction history book of politics and strategy, or a memoir, this is both a combination of all three categories and none of the three categories at the same time. Its vast scope of content is beyond any Vietnam War book I have read. It is a collection of interviews conducted by the author with people related to all aspects of the Vietnam War. South Vietnamese veterans, Viet Cong guerillas, North Vietnamese doctors and diplomats, American draft-dodgers and politicians are just some of the people interviewed for the book. Christian Appy even interviewed Nikita Khrushchev's son, General Westmoreland, and General Giap! The memories of everyone from the lowliest infantryman to the highest ranking strategic commanders and politicians are recorded in this book. I would recommend this book to everyone. It is a masterpiece. Definitely one of my favorite books.
September 23, 2010
Incredible primary source about the Vietnam War. Stories told from all sides - from the soldiers on both sides, to nurses, commoners, doctors, generals in the US (and Vietnam) and everything in-between. Amazing. If you've ever wanted a "full" perspective of what the war was (and was like) to everybody involved, this is your book. It is all first-hand accounts and the stories are amazing. From Vietcong using the tubing from downed-aircraft for blood-transfusions to women peasants filling in bomb-craters with buckets along the Ho Chi Minh Trail to doctors making-up phony medical "problems" to help Americans avoid the draft - the stories are chilling, enlightening, uplifting, horrifying and heartbreaking all at once. Oh...and if you ever wanted to know why the US lost the war, this tells it all. The dedication of the Vietnamese to be truly independent is awe-inspiring. Only downside of the book is that it is long....BUT, it is well worth it, though. Don't be deterred.
November 10, 2011
I was looking for a book that would give me a strong understanding of the Vietnam war as a whole. I didn't think it was possible as this is such a complex war. Yet, this book was able to provide perspectives of the war from everyone from american soldiers, journalists, and mothers to Vietnamese citizens and soldiers. This book is very intense at times as can be expected. The author does a wonderful job of providing background information when necessary. If you are looking for a book to begin learning about the Vietnam War this is an excellent book to start with. Though, it took me a few weeks to read because I had to often put it down because some of the narratives were so emotional and intense.
March 29, 2014
Although the Vietnam war was going on in my lifetime, I didn't know or really understand what it was all about. I didn't understand why our servicemen and women were not treated better when they came home. I didn't get what Jane Fonda thought she was doing. I just didn't know why any of it was as it was. This book has so many different "essays" from people who were there it becomes a little clearer but I also feel the need to understand more about the history of Vietnam. Then will probably find I need to try to figure out what our politicians where thinking. I highly recommend this book but I really think it is only the beginning to get some understanding. Views are presented from ALL sides.
July 21, 2008
Completely unbiased. I learned so much about the Vietnam war; a lot that I'm not so sure I wanted to know. But mostly, I learned that the majority of people knew next to nothing about it when it was actually happening, and people know even less now. This is a part of our country's history that most people try to ignore but this book made me realize that this was actually one of the most important eras of America. It's a long, hard read but it allows for a complete understanding of what was going on worldwide all those years ago.
September 19, 2013
I purchased this book at one of my favorite book stores - Hill Avenue Books in Spirit Lake, Iowa - probably around 2006 and read it immediately. I was reminded of this book while teaching my World Politics college course last night so wanted to add it to my Read list.
Since my two godfathers served in the US Marines in Vietnam reading this book was personally important to me but beyond that it is just an excellent book that is well written, informative, and thought provoking. Americans should reduce their average of 7 hours per day of watching TV so they have time to read this book.
Since my two godfathers served in the US Marines in Vietnam reading this book was personally important to me but beyond that it is just an excellent book that is well written, informative, and thought provoking. Americans should reduce their average of 7 hours per day of watching TV so they have time to read this book.
January 27, 2018
I read this while watching Ken Burns' documentary on the war and it was the perfect companion. What a heavy, important project with such scope. Appy interviewed infantrymen and generals, protestors and politicians, poets, artists, draft dodgers and ordinary citizens of both countries whose lives were affected by the decades-long conflict. I have a much better understanding of what went on in Vietnam after immersing myself in the voices of the "patriots" who lived through it, and I found the oral history format fascinating in all its rawness. Really well done.
August 3, 2010
I was able to learn more about the Vietnam War from "Patriots" then from any other source I have tried. It gives a 360 view of the war from all ranks and sides. I really enjoyed being able to read stories from view points not discussed regularly such as from women and Vietnamese citizens fighting on both sides of the war. Although an amazing book, I would not recommended it if the reader knows nothing about the war fought in Vietnam.
August 28, 2013
Just back from a holiday in Vietnam, and while there was exposed to many views about the war. As the author says, "...only a surprisingly narrow range of Vietnam War experiences have gained widespread attention". In this volume you can hear from the nurse, the draft dodger, the activist, the patriot, the prisoner, the artist, the poet, the diplomat and dozens of nameless Vietnamese whose voices are being heard for the first time.
May 7, 2016
WOW! If you read only one book about the Vietnam war, it has to be this one. I've never read anything like it. The author interviews every type of person that was involved in some way with the war - soldiers, leaders, medical people, politicians, protestors, POWs, etc, FROM BOTH SIDES! The result is you have a full-orbed picture of what happened in Southeast Asia. Powerful! Sobering! Sad! Thought-provoking! HIGHLY RECOMMENDED!
April 18, 2019
Prior to reading this, I have read upwards of 40 Vietnam War accounts and memoirs. This collection of players and periphery participants in the war is rich, unbiased and detailed. I loved it, and have a better understanding of the US presidency, military strategy, the communist movement, media's portrayal of the war, and the Vietnamese accounts of both the North and South. Apparent through this reading is the obvious importance of international politics and the need for bi-partisan efforts.
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