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This is the thread for the October 2023 read of Rabbit, Run.

Just logging my post so that I don't miss posts!

I will follow Sue’s good example!

I will be starting on the 1st or thereabout .

I’m in- will start on Oct 1st!

This is stacking up to be a great read!

Yes, Sara!!
I just downloaded from my library. Finishing up an IRL read first.

I just started. On page 22 of my copy Updike references a tune, “Without a Song,�� which I couldn’t remember if I had ever heard. It probably was sung by someone like Dinah Washington, but I couldn’t find that recording. It did find this one by Frank Sinatra.

And here is “Secret Love�� also referenced



and “Autumn Leaves�� both of which are more well known but perhaps not to younger readers.



Thanks to YouTube for making these accessible.

My copy has still not come in to the library. I hope I have it before the 1st.

I love all those songs, Terry. I grew up with them.

Sara, I have more recently enjoyed Paula Cole’s version of Autumn Leaves, which I think was in the soundtrack of Midnight in the Garden of Good and Evil.

In the 1970s you could have put together a whole cassette tape of songs, but Rabbit Run seems like it was written in the late fifties. By page 28, I realized that it would take too many links in these posts to do the equivalent of a themed tape for this book. But for Sara and others of our seasoning, I will just mention 2 titles, “Venus�� and “Stagger Lee.��

This book will take me a long time to read, because when there is a sound track within the pages I feel compelled to stop and listen. My library has my copy--I will get it on Monday.

Terry - The Paula Cole version of Autumn Leaves is beautiful, but Eva Cassidy is still my favorite cover. I do remember watching Jean Paul Vignon on Ed Sullivan doing it, so it frequently plays in my head with a French accent. Nobody could write like Johnny Mercer.

I will be interested in members opinions of the Rabbit and Janice of the novel as compared to the Rabbit and Janice of the film (if you saw the saw the film) and if you perceive a difference. Rabbit, Run came out at a significant time in our history when a cultural trend was swinging from right to left and conservative values were associated with the older established order and more liberal or radical ideas with younger. I think our perception of Rabbit, as hero, antihero, villain, or jerk is affected by the time we read the book and where we stood in regard to cultural happenings at that time and I thought that was the same foe Updike in how he wished it to be perceived. I am interested if my opinion on that will change and how readers who hadn't read the book in the 60's see these characters now.

Terry wrote: "I just started. On page 22 of my copy Updike references a tune, “Without a Song,�� which I couldn’t remember if I had ever heard. It probably was sung by someone like Dinah Washington, but I couldn��..."

I am familiar with only a few Western singers , and one of my favorites is Roger Whittaker- his voice weaves sheer magic ( Raindrops are falling on my window , teardrops are falling from my eyes .... ) . I listened to Frank Sinatra 's Without a song . His voice is a bit like Roger Whittaker 's . Nice song ! But the one I liked even more was Nat Cole in Autumn Leaves . How soft , dreamy and soothing his voice is ! Loved it !
Thanks for posting , Terry !

Am beginning this book today . Excited to know a new author .

I started a few days ago with my second go. I dnf’d this a few years ago, maybe not in the mood for this type of character. I’m about 50 pages in but I’ve gotten past the point I stopped last time.

I can see how people can relate to Rabbit and the Coach Tethero’s of the world. Struggling with the choices he’s made so far, remembering and pining over the old glory days not wanting to be forgotten ( even though he is still young he misses the HS days when he was the star basketball player), and wanting to do the right thing although easily swayed. This is all too common in people. It seems like he has the iconic devil on one shoulder and the angel on the other toying with him. I will be interesting seeing where this goes and how Rabbit deals with his struggles.

I read this book 50 years ago when I was 17. I did not care for it at all. I was reading it for a college course so I had no choice but to finish it. I was young and naive. What did I know of life at that point?
I think I am “getting�� it more this go round. Lori, I like your analogy to his having an Angel on one shoulder and a devil on the other. He’s a man who wants to be back to his glory days. He doesn’t want responsibilities. I seriously just want to shake him! I’ve always been a responsible person. I can’t imagine just up and leaving as he did.

It seems like back then (1950s and 1960s) there were a lot of men who married too young, felt trapped and then left their wives. It was bery sad for the women and their children.

Terri, on page 11 of my book, Rabbit thinks �� He married relatively late, when he was twenty three and she was two years out of high school…�� Times were certainly different in the late ��50’s if he thinks that is late. Of course, she was pregnant (p11again)- would he have married her otherwise? They both seem like teenagers trying to act like they are adults.

Interesting description by Lori : the iconic devil on one shoulder and the angel on the other !
I think Antoinette is right .... at 17 what does one know of life ? Usually one hasn't even understood oneself fully , let alone other people and this complicated world .

I have started this book and was surprised to find that it's not divided into chapters.... the writing is just continuous !

My parents who married when I was 6 months old were 18 in 1950. My mother was just barely 18. They were kids. They had 4 kids by the time they were 23. They were much too young. It was not completely unusual at the time.

I think 23 is young to have children now. Perhaps not for some women, because they mature faster than men do. Personally, I don’t know if I have ever met a man under 27 or 28 that was really ready to get married, much less start a family. Or, at least, I didn’t meet them. Of course, I am generalizing, but I think children are better served having mature parents.

But what happened in the sixties was very hard on wives snd mothers because there were a lot of men who thought the grass was greener elsewhere. Maybe that is still the case; it’s been too long for me to know. But it makes it hard for me to have a lot of sympathy for Rabbit’s plight.

I can’t say I have much sympathy for Rabbit, either. I also agree with your comment, Terri, that men should never marry before they are at least 27. It seems in this book,anyways ,that women turn a blind eye to the philandering. I am just past half way done and as I have no memory of how this book ends, I am interested in seeing how Updike resolves the story.

Hmm .... agree with the above comment on the advisable age of marriage for men . Not only do they become more emotionally mature by that age , but they are more likely to get professionally settled by then , and that , too , is important for stability of a marriage . Rest , of course , depends on an individual 's own particular character . If a person has an uncontrolled tendency to philandering, neither correct age of marriage , nor professional stability, nor a background family stability and influence may have much stabilizing effect ( but at least the chances are lesser ) . It’s bad luck for a woman and her children , untill she chooses to forge ahead and find her own pathway , which , I think, is not a bad idea after a reasonably long period of condoning , forgiveness and genuine attempts to make it for the kids' sake .

I have reached page 8 . I liked the words of the TV advertiser : Know thyself. Learn to understand your talents and then work to develop them . That's the way to be happy . He also mentions that God gave us each a different talent ... some are meant to be musicians , some are meant to be authors , some are meant to be athletes .... and so on .
Excellent advice on the road of life , especially so for those who are yet only on the threshold , but also applicable much further on .

I'm on page 34 (paperback) and I have mixed feelings about both Rabbit and Janice. I still haven't formed a concrete opinion. (view spoiler)[What he is doing is not right, but it was so spontaneous that it felt as if he was being pursued and needed to run. I think I can relate to his feeling of being trapped and unhappy. Of course, this is no solution at all. This leads to more unhappiness, and he has the responsibility of the child. Leaving is one thing, staying gone will be another.

I felt the angst of his looking through the window at his family and remembering the carefree days with his sister. It is not easy to be an adult and need to put others first. He forgets, however, that someone did that for him; that his carefree days were compliments of his father shouldering the burdens.

One thing I really love is the lyrical, almost musical cadence of the writing. When he is describing the trip through Lancaster, Maryland and D.C., I am riding shotgun. I have made that trip so many times that I could look out his window and see the scenery that is passing him by.

The station attendant is correct, though, "the only way to get somewhere, you know, is to figure out where you are going before you get there." The only place Rabbit is going is "away". (hide spoiler)]

I’m about halfway. I just finished up the first long section. I must say, I’m not happy about where Rabbit has taken himself. Sara, I agree with your take on the situation so far. Rabbit wasn’t thinking at all and has no plan or “destination�� in mind in the moment.

(view spoiler)[If he is a Christian as he claims, he will have some repenting to do if he ever wakes up and realizes the depths of his behavior toward himself and his family. So far, he hasn’t given a good reason for leaving and not going home. He is acting very impulsive and that never works in one’s favor.
His conversation with the pastor has him thinking but that devil on his shoulder is a much bigger influence right now. Oh, and I really dislike reading sex scenes and that went on way too long for my taste. Ugh! I know that may be prudish, but I don’t apologize for it. All I can take from that part is that when one acts on impulses that aren’t logical (impulsivity is never logical, is it?) they make poor judgements. We see that when he realizes Ruth isn’t as pretty the next morning.
I’m not sure where this is going. (hide spoiler)]

I am on page 35 . It's too , too surprising how ☆☆Beware Spoilers (view spoiler)[ Harry , all of a sudden , leaves his wife , small son and old parents ! I didn't even realize his intention initially ! No reason is given except that his wife drinks and smokes excessively . That can't be reason enough surely ? What about his son whom he seems to love ? And the anguish of his old parents ? Oh my God , what chaos would be there in this world if everyone started behaving so selfishly , unpredictably, inexplicably and irresponsibly 🙄 ! Reminds me somewhat of Chris' behavior in Into the Wild, only thing , there , some explanation was given . Let's see what happens in this story .
I am not too enamored with the author's language . It's intermittently choppy - there are half sentences whose meanings are quite lost on me . (hide spoiler)] ☆☆
Sara , I think you will be able to appreciate better the scenes through Lancaster etc . I am finding it a bit dreary .
I totally agree about the station attendant 's remark . And , if you don't know where you are going, then it , of course , doesn't matter which way you take ( taken from a scene in Alice in Wonderland ) !

I have finished this and have been holding my thoughts so as not to spoil anything for others. I think this is a difficult read for some of us at present since there are multiple ideas in this book that are at their nadir of social acceptance. For those of you that are sensitive, I feel for you, but hope you press on to the end before passing full judgement. I think the book is a particularly good example of themes rooted in the time of publication and becomes more understandable with discussion. For example, Updike's style I feel is definitely a reponse to the censorial lock that was on literature and all arts preceding his work and is exaggerated in an attempt to break conventions.

I am linking a well known critique of Updike and his ilk by David Foster Wallace which I suggest you read when finished with the novel. It is only one perspective but I think it carries into our present assessment, but other opinions are needed as well for a more complete picture.

I have finished the first section. (view spoiler)[Rabbit is as genuinely unlikable a person as I have ever encountered. I had a touch of sympathy for his feelings in the beginning, but what kind of sorry a** leaves his wife and son in this way, takes up with a whore and then tells her he loves her one day later? There just isn't anyone to like in this book--I didn't like Janice, even though the encounter was brief, I think the Coach is reprehensible, Ruth is about to get what she is due, Eccles is a poor excuse for a spiritual counselor, and Rabbit is despicable.

I will finish this book, but something major is going to have to light upon me for me to commit to any more time with Rabbit Angstrom. (hide spoiler)]

Amen, Sara. I’ve just finished the novel and need to process. I’ll be interested in what you and others think of the rest of Rabbit’s story. I’ll share some thoughts when I can.

I will say that since I finished this book, I have had trouble leaving it behind. Rabbit has invaded my thoughts.

Antoinette wrote: "I will say that since I finished this book, I have had trouble leaving it behind. Rabbit has invaded my thoughts."

Hmm ... so , there is something more in this book . You've given it 5 stars . So also is Sam's comment .

I have only reached page 53 as yet .... ☆☆Beware Spoilers (view spoiler)[ the part where Harry has come back to Brewer, but not to his home , having gone instead to coach Tothero . (hide spoiler)] ☆☆ The writing style has improved and I am liking the story , so far , as it unfolds .

Savita, glad you have started to enjoy the writing style more. I noticed as I read that the way Updike chose to write sort of mirrored the scene and how the character was behaving if they were nervous or excited. You'll see this with Janice later in the book when the sentences get a run-on vibe and the grammar seems off. It's as if Updike is writing the scenes coming from inside the character's heads.

I did find Updike's way with prose to be quite catching. I mean, it takes you into the places and people's emotions in a way that grabs and won't let go. I did enjoy his style.

I am still trying to figure out my rating. While there were themes and scenes that abhorred me, I think that Updike didn't want us to like any of the characters and his depictions are realistic whether we enjoy them or not. I do believe there were and are still Rabbit's and Janice's in the world as well as Reverend Eccles.

I think Rabbit has to be the most reprehensible, irresponsible, emotionally immature man-boy I've read. He is the epitome of searching for something and looking for it in all the wrong places. He is desperate to find it and seems to let many other things (view spoiler)[sex, sex, sex, irresponsibility, and anything that he doesn't already have because he's stuck in his past glory (hide spoiler)] get in his way. He is just unable to navigate the life that he has created for himself and I think (view spoiler)[that Rabbit is afraid to wake up and find out that the thing he's searching for is nowhere to be found. (hide spoiler)]

Lori, I agree with just about everything you are saying. I decided to give the book a 5 star rating, actually 4.5 rounded up. I haven’t written my review yet. I am trying to figure out what to say. But I thought this book was very well written.

Sam, thanks for the link!

One of the sad things for me to consider is that there are still men just like Rabbit walking amongst us.

Thanks Terry. I hope I didn’t sat too much for those still reading. I am leaning toward 4 fair stars.

Lori wrote: "Savita, glad you have started to enjoy the writing style more. I noticed as I read that the way Updike chose to write sort of mirrored the scene and how the character was behaving if they were nerv..."

Lori , your comment is so astute and mature , I liked everything that you mentioned .
Yes , I see .... the author's writing style mirrors the scene and characters that he's describing ! Amazing , I've never come across this type of writing before ! In the beginning, I was rather annoyed by the choppy and pompous half sentences, whose meaning just passed me by .
Yes , agreed , his characters are very realistic , whether we enjoy them or not 🤔 . We do need to become aware of / acquainted with the Rabbits and Janices of the world , though it may be an unwanted disillusionment 🤔 . I haven't come across Reverend Eccles as yet .
By holding up the images of Rabbit , Janice etc in front of society, I think the author is giving a warning message in his own way by hopefully jolting some consciences - but I haven't read too far into the book to really comment on this .

I have just finished and this is not a novel that you complete and immediately know exactly what you think. I will be mulling it for a while. I will say the second half of the book goes a long way toward justifying the first half.

Sara wrote: "I have just finished and this is not a novel that you complete and immediately know exactly what you think. I will be mulling it for a while. I will say the second half of the book goes a long way ..."

Hmm .... I see . I am on page 75 ( didn't get much reading time today ) . I am really going through seesaw emotions while reading this book . Sometimes , as at present , I want to give the author a real shake and ask him to cut out so much crap ( Like Lori has mentioned ☆☆Beware Spoilers (view spoiler)[ prolonged sex scenes which land up irritating you . (hide spoiler)] ☆☆ ) .

I read the first book in the series a long time ago and was going to read this after I finished the second book, but with this buddy read, I decided to join in. I am starting a little late after *ahem* struggling to finish another novel (DNF). I agree with Sara about the lyrical writing. Rabbit says he is happy where he is but is always scoping up the women, which means he is not content. Rabbit reminds me a little of a milder version of Andrew Dice Clay, objectifying women, and is my mental picture of Rabbit, at least for now.

That’s quite an interesting comparison to Rabbit, Pharmacdon. I would say I’d abhor Andrew Dice Clay as well so it fits.

The writing is the very best part of this novel.

I have read up to page 143 . ☆☆Beware Spoilers (view spoiler)[ On page 98 the author says ... When Ruth serves him lunch he sees she is a better cook than Janice . This made me recall Charles Dickens ' words ( I don't recall which novel ) .... Easier to be a mistress than a wife ! A wife has a myriad jobs to get done , a myriad responsibilities to shoulder 🤔 . A mistress just has to sit around making herself attractive 🤨 . And a husband has to grow up fully to be able to appreciate and value his , perhaps , faded wife ! (hide spoiler)] ☆☆

I have read up to page 168 . The view points of the different people involved , concerning Rabbit 's behavior, is interesting - Rev Eccles , Mrs Springer, Mrs ( Ma ) Angstrom and Rabbit 's father 🤔 . A saying ( I presume ) quoted by Mrs Angstrom struck me .... Some die young , and some are born old . How true ! Some , of course , just never grow up , never learn to take responsibilities , never learn to handle people maturely , like ☆☆Beware Spoilers (view spoiler)[ our Rabbit (hide spoiler)] .
But , I think , there also some innately innocent people , who continue to remain naive throughout their lives because they have the rare good fortune of having a sheltered adulthood, after they've left a sheltered childhood behind . They seem to be so buffered from life's slaps and storms . I don't know whether this is a good thing or not . May be it's all the question of previous good karmas ( deeds) 🤔 ?
Then , there are those that are trully born old ! They seem so adept at handling life right from the start ! Well , lucky souls , I suppose .
I must say we are curious mix , we human beings ! some die young ; some are born old . Well ! Well !

I have some last thoughts to mention on this novel before the month's close but first is anyone continuing with the next in the series, Rabbit Redux for November?

I have started the novel. Eons ago, a professor recommended the series to his students. So far I find that the wife and husband are both disappointed in marriage or at least not much invested in it. She does not consider the simple conveniwnce of having the door unlocked. There is no desire to get home to comforts of family and home. Even how the apartment is set up with awkward with television position not allowing easy access to closet and with the closet door not allowing for secure connection of television into wall.

A much less literary and more nonfiction version might be The Man in the Gray Flannel Suit by Sloan Wilson. It was a movie much mentioned by my larents and their friends.

Cynda wrote: "I have started the novel. Eons ago, a professor recommended the series to his students. So far I find that the wife and husband are both disappointed in marriage or at least not much invested in it..."

I am just a bit sorry for Janice , Cynda . Everything is going wrong for her , or else , she's doing the wrong things . ☆☆Beware Spoilers (view spoiler)[ An alcoholic. ? chain smoker . Home in shambles. Maybe , just maybe , if she had had a strong , mature , caring husband , her life may have been redeemed. A quote : Treat a man as he is , and he will remain as he is. Treat a man as he could be, and he will become what he should be. . Harry just walks out on her and their 2 year old boy ! At least Mr Angstrom ( Harry 's father 's sympathies are with his daughter in law. Rev Eccles seems to be more with Harry . (hide spoiler)] ☆☆ Let's see how the story progresses .

Am around page 250 now . I am a bit amazed by the turn of events . ☆☆Beware Spoilers (view spoiler)[ Rabbit leaves Ruth with the words - " My wife is having a baby . I got to go see her through it . I 'll be back in a couple of hours . I love you. " Amazing sense of responsibility ! He thinks that having a quick 2 hours peep at his wife and new born child is a great job done ? Okay , never mind the wife . What is his idea of the parental role in the upbringing , love , security and protection of a kid's vulnerable, precious and innocent childhood ? Then , too , taking even a purely self centered view , does it not occur to him that in his vulnerable , aging years , he will , one day , require the support of this very same child , for whom he intends to spare not more than 2 hours on the present day . 🤔

Then , all of a sudden , just the way he left , he suddenly decides to stay on . Now , here he is , telling his wife that he loves her !
I was quite surprised at the way Janice accepts him back , with no display of resistance . Can this happen in real life ? Actually, emotional trauma is only part of the picture . There is also the issue of very dangerous and devastating STDs ( like syphilis and AIDS - chronic diseases , which turn life into a living hell ) being carried and transmitted by people like Ruth and Rabbit. The better thing to do is to have a person like Rabbit undergo a complete medical test , and a good course of counseling by psychologists and priests, like Rev Eccles , before accepting him back in the family . Marriage is of course important ( for all three generations concerned ) , but there are limits to tolerance and adjustments . If the marriage has became rotten to the core , it is healthier to break up , and go forward alone , keeping the responsibilities of the children very much in focus still .
(hide spoiler)] ☆☆
Let's see what further the author has to say about the story . The continuation of the crude descriptions has put me off considerably. In stories written by Daphne du Maurier, Bronte sisters etc lascivious characters have been effectively described , without the need to enter into rather vulgar descriptions . Eloquent language pleases the mind so much , just like beautiful poetry and music .