The History Book Club discussion
FAVORITES! AND NOT SO FAVORITES
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FAVORITE THINGS - GETTING TO KNOW YOU
message 51:
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Bentley, Group Founder, Leader, Chief
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Feb 02, 2010 01:55PM

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Hi Bentley, I'm sort of surprised, why Winston Churchill? Wouldn't most Americans nominate George Washington or Abe Lincoln as their favourite historical figures? (I don't mean to stereotype either).
message 55:
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´¡²Ô»å°ùé, Honorary Contributor - EMERITUS - Music
(last edited Feb 02, 2010 02:52PM)
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The unknown, whose stories got lost in the wind. Sometimes they posed the shoulders for others to lean on or built the cathedrals, fought the wars, bore the children, wrote the unprinted stories and just existed.
They lacked the strength, or also the ruthlessness, the money, the family or were at the wrong place at the wrong time to make history.
But they did anyway. We just forgot about them.
They lacked the strength, or also the ruthlessness, the money, the family or were at the wrong place at the wrong time to make history.
But they did anyway. We just forgot about them.

Bentley wrote: "No it is Winston Churchill for me. (smile)"
Winston most definitely was the right man at the right place at the right time. Although I don't like to call those days the "right" time...
Winston most definitely was the right man at the right place at the right time. Although I don't like to call those days the "right" time...

Andre, so beautifully stated.
´¡²Ô»å°ùé wrote: "Bentley wrote: "No it is Winston Churchill for me. (smile)"
Winston most definitely was the right man at the right place at the right time. Although I don't like to call those days the "right" ti..."
Very true
Winston most definitely was the right man at the right place at the right time. Although I don't like to call those days the "right" ti..."
Very true


For those who do not appreciate the genius of Groucho (yet), my uncle was a film collector and so I grew up with the stuff, and now my kids are avid Marx brothers, Buster Keaton, Charlie Chaplin fans. I really think Buster Keaton's "The General" one of the finest comic films. And his "Go West" is surely one of the finest examples of using a trained cow in cinematography.
Alisa wrote: "I'm still waiting for someone to reference other stuff from "The Sound of Music." Maybe I'm the only one who appreciates my special brand of humor. :-)"
I did Alisa...it was two for and two against (smile)
I did Alisa...it was two for and two against (smile)

Alexander the Great is up there in my top 5, good choice!

I did Alisa...it was two fo..."
Bentley, great minds think alike.
message 67:
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´¡²Ô»å°ùé, Honorary Contributor - EMERITUS - Music
(last edited Feb 03, 2010 01:40AM)
(new)
'Aussie Rick' wrote: "... mine is Napoleon Bonaparte, anyone else?"
The problem I have with all these "great" leaders, as much as I admire their initial hopes, dreams and what not, the way they got there and what was left of it after they were gone...
I can see that we wouldn't be where we are without them, but we finally need to learn to understand that we cannot force our happiness/way of life onto others who simply don't want it.
I believe we all know this is true. We see it in everyday life. You can't change your husband/wife to make him/her fit to whatever it is you want/need/plan to do, so who then are we to think we can do it on a larger scale; transform entire nations?
The second disturbing thing about the "greats" is that somehow they all turned "mad" in the course of their lives. Napoleon's Emperor-crowning to me is much the same as Elvis or Michael Jackson.
Becoming too big too fast because the people lift you there doesn't seem to work out all too well with our system/mental installation. Almost as if it wasn't designed that way ...
Also, let's be honest, most people just "want". What I mean is it usually takes a while (if at all) before they are willing and able to really give, without wanting something in return.
The bigger these "great" people got, the more they were surrounded by selfish freaks, pushing them into directions the "greats" never thought they'd go...
The problem I have with all these "great" leaders, as much as I admire their initial hopes, dreams and what not, the way they got there and what was left of it after they were gone...
I can see that we wouldn't be where we are without them, but we finally need to learn to understand that we cannot force our happiness/way of life onto others who simply don't want it.
I believe we all know this is true. We see it in everyday life. You can't change your husband/wife to make him/her fit to whatever it is you want/need/plan to do, so who then are we to think we can do it on a larger scale; transform entire nations?
The second disturbing thing about the "greats" is that somehow they all turned "mad" in the course of their lives. Napoleon's Emperor-crowning to me is much the same as Elvis or Michael Jackson.
Becoming too big too fast because the people lift you there doesn't seem to work out all too well with our system/mental installation. Almost as if it wasn't designed that way ...
Also, let's be honest, most people just "want". What I mean is it usually takes a while (if at all) before they are willing and able to really give, without wanting something in return.
The bigger these "great" people got, the more they were surrounded by selfish freaks, pushing them into directions the "greats" never thought they'd go...

Mozart was pure genius, also a fun person to be with I think:))
message 69:
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´¡²Ô»å°ùé, Honorary Contributor - EMERITUS - Music
(last edited Feb 03, 2010 05:11AM)
(new)
Harvey, a nice thought, shifting attention away from conquerors to composers/musicians. It instantly brings to mind the thoughts Beethoven had on Napoleon.
Does/can music transform the world? If it gives us peace of mind does it change or influence the way we see others, would we be more open/tolerant of others?
Does/can music transform the world? If it gives us peace of mind does it change or influence the way we see others, would we be more open/tolerant of others?

1. Food: Spaghetti or Pizza or a nice thick steak with a lobster tail or potato skins or popcorn. So many favorite foods!
2. Non-alcoholic beverage: Dr. Pepper, Coke, coffee.
3. Alcoholic beverage: I'm definitely a wine girl but (and I'm sure this just sounds horrible) I'll try anything.
4. Band/singer: Favorite singer would have to be Sinatra, but I also really like Dean Martin. And my favorite band is definitely The Beatles.
5. Actor/Actress: The oldies...Clark Gable, Audrey Hepburn, Gregory Peck, Vivien Leigh, Marilyn Monroe, Cary Grant, Gene Kelly (what I wouldn't give to dance with him!), I'm sure there are others, but those will suffice.
6. Season: I think it would have to be the autumn or the spring, but we don't get much mild weather like that in Oklahoma.
7. Terrain: It really depends on my mood, but I think I could always appreciate being in a cabin in the woods.
8. Car: I really love my Jeep. But I don't think I could turn down a Jag or a Mercedes or a Rolls or a classic Mustang. That's pretty much the extent of my car knowledge.
9. Animal: I've always had a thing for monkeys and sea otters.
10. Activity: Outside of reading...I'd have to say that I love sitting in the sun, drinking a Coke over crushed ice and eating a Snickers.
Lori...it is funny but your list really highlights the simple things in life that are actually the ones that make us happiest even just eating a childhood mega treat like a Snickers. And I love my jeep too.

I can't imagine being able to spend some time with these people.

Does/can music transform the world? If it..."
Hi Andre, it would be nice if music could change the world and make people more tolerant, the problem is you have to get them to listen to the music. I love classical music, but there's no way in hell my daughter is giving up her gothic come headbanging stuff for Beethoven or Mozart. They conducted a trial of playing classical music in bus shelters where young rat-bags use to gather to cause trouble. It was supposed to make them mellow out, that didn't work but it did drive them out :)
message 75:
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´¡²Ô»å°ùé, Honorary Contributor - EMERITUS - Music
(last edited Feb 03, 2010 12:51PM)
(new)
Haha, very funny Rick. Well, guess forcing things won't work... Some of these headbanging guys do ballads too - which their fans seem to like. Often the melodies are ... hmmm ... let's say dead-simple. Maybe it's a first step...
But then not everybody needs to love classical music to enter heaven, right? How about some blues or bebop, soul, whatever, just as long as they are happy and don't ruin the lives of everybody else...
But then not everybody needs to love classical music to enter heaven, right? How about some blues or bebop, soul, whatever, just as long as they are happy and don't ruin the lives of everybody else...

That's very true Andre, if we were all content with our life then the world would be a much happier place.



Harvey;
As a matter of fact, Meatloaf was a Broadway actor who was doing various productions including the Broadway cast of Hair before appearing in the rock opera Rocky Horror Picture Show (yes, I remember attending the mid-night showings) and his break-through album “Bat out of Hell�. Not so ironically, the creative genius behind “Bat out of Hell� was a gentleman by the name of Jim Steinman who partnered with Andrew Lloyd Webber on the production of Whistle Down the Wind, a musical that my wife and I loved when we saw it in DC but never made it to Broadway.
BTW, Aussie Rick, I agree with you sentiments about some of the short lived groups versus Beethoven and, my favorite, Mozart. How many one-hit wonders can you name from the 80’s or 90’s let alone the 60’s or 70’s?

Lori..you listed them very well...Grand Cherokee Limited - Jeep. It takes you wherever you want to go. It does not hold you back.
And for Jim...35 one hit wonders from the 80s
I remember Waiting for a Star to Fall.
And for Jim...35 one hit wonders from the 80s
I remember Waiting for a Star to Fall.


1. Food: Seafood, especially lobster; breakfast food; raspberries
2. Non-alcoholic beverage: Ice water
3. Alcoholic beverage: when I was able to drink, it was White Russians
4. Pop singer/Group: Fleetwood Mac; U2; Michael McDonald; Jennifer Hudson
Country: Lady Antebellum (Lady A); several other recent ones, but not Taylor Swift; Dolly Parton; Kenny Rogers
Rock singer/Group: Meat Loaf; Led Zeppelin
Classical: The Late Pavarotti; Dame Joan Sutherland; Marilyn Horne; many others in the 60's/70's
Other: Enigma (wrote The Age of Innocence, great video)
5. Actor/Actress: Many, especially classics like Bette Davis; Bogey,etc.; in the last decade: Tom Hanks, Mr. & Mrs. Paul Newman; Gena Rowlands; Phillip Seymour Hoffman; Anthony Hopkins
6. Season: Late Fall; snow in winter
7. Terrain: Seacoast
8. Car: loved the 80's full-size Buicks - drove one that could really fly up a steep hill
9. Animal: cats (have a half Persian/half Russian Blue)
10. Activity: reading; computers
11. Painters: Wyeths, especially Andrew and Jamie; O'Keeffe; Caravaggio; van Gogh; Michelangelo;
Ah Virginia the late Pavarotti...a real favorite of mine. Anthony Hopkins and the Newmans (although we sorely miss Paul Newman).
You should love this winter then with all of the new snow. Your cat sounds beautiful; at one time I had a cat that was half Persian and half Himalayan (a beautiful animal); although I am very much a dog person.
Of course, O'Keefe..(brilliant) and I love the Wyeths too, and so many of the others.
Great list.
You should love this winter then with all of the new snow. Your cat sounds beautiful; at one time I had a cat that was half Persian and half Himalayan (a beautiful animal); although I am very much a dog person.
Of course, O'Keefe..(brilliant) and I love the Wyeths too, and so many of the others.
Great list.

1. Food: Chinese and Italian
2. Non-alcoholic beverage: coffee
3. Alcoholic beverage: coffee with baileys, chardonnay
4. Band/singer: oasis, keane, adele, duffy, russell watson
5. Actor/Actress: ewan mcgregor, nicole kidman
6. Season: anything but rainy
7. Terrain: mountainous?
8. Car: anything offroad/military-ish
9. Animal: DOG
10. Activity: reading (obviously), watch movies and tv series, karaoke
I thought I'd add another:
11. Historical places to visit before I die: Lhasa, Jerusalem, Egypt (Thebes, etc), Old Trafford Stadium (no, seriously), Colosseum, Pantheon and the Forbidden City.
Interesting Silvana...why the Old Trafford Stadium; the Forbidden City is well worth the quest. Of course the others are too...but I have been there and was amazed.

Because I'm a ManUtd fan so going to OT stadium would be like a pilgrimage for me :)
Forbidden City and Lhasa, that should be doable in one trip.
It can be if you get permission to visit Lhasa in advance of your trip; I am not sure if I remember how China treats Lhasa and whether it is considered an in and out of China like going to Hong Kong was. So make sure you get the proper number of entries and exits approved in advance on your visa.
Here is some info:
What documentations do I need to travel on your programs in China?
1) A passport, valid for at least 3 month after your visit to China and the necessary visa or permits if you are traveling with our program. The visa should be approved prior to entering China and a permit for Tibet must be obtained 15 days before entering Tibet. If you only plan to travel and stay in Hong Kong you are exempt from applying for a China visa.
2) Most people only need to apply for a single –entry visa, which is usually valid for 3 months after the issuing date and will permit you to stay in China for a maximum of 30 days.
3) You need permits to go to Tibet. If you only go to Lhasa, a Tibet permit will be sufficient but, if you want to go further to the "unopened" areas, you also need an Alien's travel permit issued by the PSB of Tibet.
4) If you are to travel to Tibet, you are required to provide a doctor's certificate stating that you are fit to travel and your blood pressure and heart condition are normal in case that the very high altitude have the possible effects on you.
5) We suggest you take your medical record with you in case that you need it in the event of an emergency, and please also take with you your doctor's name, address and phone number, emergency contact name and phone number, and your insurance company's name, address and phone number.
Also more:
Should I need to apply for visa again after leaving and re-entering mainland China?
Yes, you need to apply for a double- or multiple entry visa when you need to leave and re-enter mainland China. Please note that, even when you leave for Hong Kong or Macao from mainland China, you still need to have a double- or multiple entry visa.
Here is some info:
What documentations do I need to travel on your programs in China?
1) A passport, valid for at least 3 month after your visit to China and the necessary visa or permits if you are traveling with our program. The visa should be approved prior to entering China and a permit for Tibet must be obtained 15 days before entering Tibet. If you only plan to travel and stay in Hong Kong you are exempt from applying for a China visa.
2) Most people only need to apply for a single –entry visa, which is usually valid for 3 months after the issuing date and will permit you to stay in China for a maximum of 30 days.
3) You need permits to go to Tibet. If you only go to Lhasa, a Tibet permit will be sufficient but, if you want to go further to the "unopened" areas, you also need an Alien's travel permit issued by the PSB of Tibet.
4) If you are to travel to Tibet, you are required to provide a doctor's certificate stating that you are fit to travel and your blood pressure and heart condition are normal in case that the very high altitude have the possible effects on you.
5) We suggest you take your medical record with you in case that you need it in the event of an emergency, and please also take with you your doctor's name, address and phone number, emergency contact name and phone number, and your insurance company's name, address and phone number.
Also more:
Should I need to apply for visa again after leaving and re-entering mainland China?
Yes, you need to apply for a double- or multiple entry visa when you need to leave and re-enter mainland China. Please note that, even when you leave for Hong Kong or Macao from mainland China, you still need to have a double- or multiple entry visa.

Note: I'm not including Portuguese references for the time being.
Follow this, here are my favorite, although I might come back later to complete the list...
1. Food: Any dish with Mushrooms in it but not only.
2. Non-alcoholic beverage: Water or milk, or even ginger ale.
3. Alcoholic beverage: None, I don't drink anything with alcohol in it.
4. Band/singer: Now, this is the really hard part... Queen, Marillion, Led Zeppelin, Bruce Springsteen, Muse, to mention a few.
4.1 Composers: Bach, Wagner, Mahler, Barber, Holt, among others.
5. Actor/Actress: Sean Connery, Audrey Hepburn, Jack Nicholson, De Niro, Ingrid Bergman, Colin Firth, Meryl Streep, Johnny Depp, David Suchet, the guys at Monty Python (Pallin, Idle, Chapman, Jones, Gilliam and Cleese), Dan Aykroyd, Daniel Craig, Angela Lansbury, Ewan MacGregor... I give up, they're just too many.
5.1 Directors: Stanley Kubrick, Tim Burton, Ingmar Bergman, Clint Eastwood, the Cohen brothers, Francis Ford Coppola, Sophia Copolla, Steven Soderbergh, Akira Kurosawa, Brian De Palma, Martin Scorsese, George Lucas, Emir Kusturica, David Lynch.
6. Season: Winter.
7. Terrain: the Sea.
8. Car: A safe one.
9. Animal: Any animal but spiders.
10. Activity: Collecting postcards, photography, writing, playing music.
11. Historical place: Any place medieval.
12. Historical character: I haven't decided yet. Most likely I'll stick to our D. João II (I know I wrote I was going to keep Portuguese references out for now but...); other than him, Charlemagne.
13. Painters/sculptors/and so on: Bosch, Van Gogh, Monet, Bruegel, Caravaggio, El Greco, Rembrandt, Munch, as far as I can remember.


Well the factI don't drink alcohol doesn't mean I don't like it. I can't drink because of a health problem I suffer from. All the drinks I like are very strong and while my liver is processing it, it stops producing other substances my body needs to fight constant pain. Hence, I can only sip a alcoholic beverage and not actually drink it.
Is this clear?!

1. Food: Bourbon Street Steak
2. Non-alcoholic beverage: Dr.Pepper
3. Alcoholic beverage: Under legal drinking age
4. Band/singer: New Found Glory
5. Actor/Actress: n/a
6. Season: winter
7. Terrain: desert
8. Car: Porsche 911
9. Animal: fox
10. Activity: reading, shooting, and writing poetry
Great list Martin...so you like Porsches...when I was a little younger, I used to have a framed print of a black 911.
Martin wrote: "Thanks Bentley. Yes, my dream car is a black Porsche 911. I will eventually own one, one day."
Good for you.
Good for you.

1. Food: So many good things, but probably the breakfast burrito at a local restaurant called The Range here in Albuquerque.
2. Non-alcoholic beverage: Good coffee.
3. Alcoholic beverage: None now, I've been sober going on twenty years, but it used to be a good dark lager beer, or Irish Mist.
4. Band/singer: It keeps changing. The last couple of CDs I bought are by Blue Man Group (a lot of their stuff has a kind of Ventures-ish sound). I do like both a lot of rock and a lot of classical, and the classical influences are easy to hear in a lot of good rock. For example, the Beatles used a lesser-known and kind of archaic scale on Eleanor Rigby.
5. Actor/Actress: No one in particular, but I like the ones who kind of disappear into their roles, like Gene Hackman, Dustin Hoffman, Helen Mirren, etc. instead of playing the same character with minor variations over and over a la Tom Cruise and Keanu Reeves.
6. Season: Summer - I love long hot days.
7. Terrain: The Rocky Mountains, especially the Sandia Mountains on the east edge of Albuquerque.
8. Car: Mid-60s Corvette, probably, although I've always wanted a Porsche 914 too - either way, it would be candy-apple brown and all the trim that would ordinarily be chrome would be bronze instead. I used to have a Toyota Corolla XRS that was a blast to drive, too, a thinly disguised sports car.
9. Animal: A good dog, preferably a medium-to-large breed like a black or chocolate lab or a German shepherd, although I like cats too. At the zoo, the big cats.
10. Activity: Other than reading? Writing, fiddling with the computer, sleeping.
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