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Robert wrote: "...just reserved a copy at the library; loved reading the comments here"

It's a must-read, and it is scary--VERY SCARY! The subject is new to me. I haven't come across any such Christian Right in Germany. (And I had always thought Catholics were about as medieval as it gets.) I will review the book when I will have finished reading.

Sounds interesting....I will check it out.

Hi Lilo - just got the book and read the jacket and synopss - I live in the deep south and frequently am made aware of the extreme views held by many - to start with, we have those who (with gun in hand) walk into a church and kill as many as they can...after listening to a sermon...and so it goes

Hi, Robert, I just accidentally came across your comment. I think I posted my preliminary review as a comment instead as a review. And I didn't get a notification. You must know that I am a 105% computer-idiot.--I am now in the middle of reading this book. Will post a review when I will have finished reading.

All I can say is I hope it is an exaggeration, or that they only represent a minor fringe element...I guess time will tell..scary for sure

Robert wrote: "All I can say is I hope it is an exaggeration, or that they only represent a minor fringe element...I guess time will tell..scary for sure"

I am afraid it is neither an exaggeration nor a minor fringe element. Chris Hedges gives clear facts and numbers.

I finished reading the book a week ago. Yet we went out of town right after and just got back a few hours ago. I hope I'll find time to review the book soon.

Travelin wrote: "I'm sorry, but when I'm an old man, I hope the nurses drag me into the shower at all hours of the night."

:-)

Great review, and another book to add or download (maybe the latter as I have way too many paper books all over the house, in boxes etc.).

One of the books on my "to read" list is Kevin Kruse's "One Nation Under God". One of the jacket blurbs says "Prepare yourself for a startling and important discovery: 'Christian America' is not a legacy of the nation's founders or a construct of the Cold War Era. Rather ... it was the deliberate invention of conservative corporate leaders who allied with like-minded clergymen in the 1930s to fight the antichrist they most feared: Franklin Roosevelts's New Deal."

Lilo, you might find it an interesting read. I have it in the "queue".

Lilo,

Great review. I must agree with everything you said

Peter
_______

Sorry, Lilo, but I think it's ridiculous to worry for one minute about the Christian right in this country when there are so many more pressing problems and huge concerns bearing down on it from every other direction. If you value this country and the concepts it stands for (freedom of speech, religion, opportunity, etc.), then you would be much wiser to concern yourself with the out-sized influence of the radical left than with anything anyone tries to convince you to fear from the right. There is just no comparison.

LVRichardson wrote: "Sorry, Lilo, but I think it's ridiculous to worry for one minute about the Christian right in this country when there are so many more pressing problems and huge concerns bearing down on it from ev..."

Sorry, but the Christian right might be Taliban light right now, but that could easily change.

LVRichardson wrote: "Sorry, Lilo, but I think it's ridiculous to worry for one minute about the Christian right in this country when there are so many more pressing problems and huge concerns bearing down on it from ev..."

And both the radical right and the radical left are akin, and birds of a feather. At the extremes, right amd left meet, which can already be seen in the USA.

Gundula wrote: And both the radical right and the radical left are akin, and birds of a feather. At the extremes, right amd left meet, which can already be seen in the USA.

Except the radical left is far far more influential right now than the right could ever hope to be. Its influence is strong in this administration, in our universities, in Hollywood, and in the mainstream media. The radical left is winning the culture wars. The country has been changing for 60 years, but some of the most dramatic changes have come in just the past few. If you're happy with it, then more power to you, but I think we are living in the same kind of time as was lived in the late 1920's to 1930's--very dangerous times indeed--and not because of Christian right wing "fascists". That is a laughable proposition.

LVRichardson wrote: "Gundula wrote: And both the radical right and the radical left are akin, and birds of a feather. At the extremes, right amd left meet, which can already be seen in the USA.

Except the radical lef..."

The radical left and the radical right are brothers. Just look at Stalin and Hitler.

LVRichardson wrote: "Gundula wrote: And both the radical right and the radical left are akin, and birds of a feather. At the extremes, right amd left meet, which can already be seen in the USA.

Except the radical lef..."

I hope you are not insinuating that anyone not to the far right of centre is a radical left winger. Because if you are that is both a woefully naive and a dangerous attitude, Being a centrist or even slightly left wing does not make one a radical Communist. Understand?

I'm saying the far right is not worth worrying about in this day and age. The far left is more dangerous, and more powerful. Where you stand on the spectrum is up to you.

LVRichardson wrote: "I'm saying the far right is not worth worrying about in this day and age. The far left is more dangerous, and more powerful. Where you stand on the spectrum is up to you."

And I say that both the far right and the far left are alike and thus equally dangerous. All extremists, be they right wing or be they left wing are the same, and a serious global threat. And we deny this at our peril.

LVRichardson wrote: "Gundula wrote: "LVRichardson wrote: "I'm saying the far right is not worth worrying about in this day and age. The far left is more dangerous, and more powerful. Where you stand on the spectrum is ..."

Sorry, they might have differences with economics, but everything else is the same. I guess we will have to agree to disagree, but in my opinion, the most radical social conservatives are very much akin to Stalinists, at least when it comes to wanting to dictate, to impose their views on others.

Radical social conservatives aren't sending anyone to the gulag or the re-education camps. They aren't starving anyone. They aren't imprisoning, torturing, or executing anyone. Radical conservatives are not "akin to Stalin". Stalin was a mass-murdering totalitarian. It's un-serious to compare him with a conservative.

LVRichardson wrote: "Radical social conservatives aren't sending anyone to the gulag or the re-education camps. They aren't starving anyone. They aren't imprisoning, torturing, or executing anyone. Radical conservative..."

Sorry, but the most radical aocial conservatives might not be Stalin, but they have some similar attitudes. Like Canada's former PM Stephen Harper acted very much like a personal dictator and reminded me in the way he considered everyone crtitical of him as an enemy, of Erich Honecker and Vladimir Putin.

If you think "radical social conservatives" are this country's biggest threat, comparable to Stalin, then there is no point in further discussion.

LVRichardson wrote: "If you think "radical social conservatives" are this country's biggest threat, comparable to Stalin, then there is no point in further discussion."

I said that ALL RADICALS are a threat.

LVRichardson wrote: "If you think "radical social conservatives" are this country's biggest threat, comparable to Stalin, then there is no point in further discussion."

And really, if you think the USA is radically left wing then you really need to give your head a shake.

Gundula wrote: I said that ALL RADICALS ar..."

And I say you're wrong. ALL radicals are NOT a threat. It takes no courage whatsoever to criticize Christians or even the Canadian PM. You KNOW nothing is going to happen to you. You do it just to feel good about yourself. It has no other significance or benefit. This country is not under threat from radical Christian conservatives, and to think so is wacky. Even if radical Christians are gathering somewhere right now with plans to overthrow the government, or whatever it is you think they're about to do, they have no power and no influence. To spend any time at all worrying about them is nonsense when there are REAL threats out there so much closer, so much more powerful, and so much more dangerous to actual human life and way of life. That is what I said.

LVRichardson wrote: "Gundula wrote: I said that ALL RADICALS ar..."

And I say you're wrong. ALL radicals are NOT a threat. It takes no courage whatsoever to criticize Christians or even the Canadian PM. You KNOW nothi..."

The USA is not being threatened by the radical left wing. If you think Obama is radically and extremist left wing, you are simply and extremely wrong. I do not particularly like Obama, but neither he, nor the Democrats are Communists or extremist left wingers. The threat to the USA comes from dangerous radicals like Donald Trump and the goose stepping unwashed who support him. Donald Trump looks and even acts like Adolf Hitler, in fact, there is a definite taint of Fascism (and Stalinism, just to get you riled up a bit more) in the Rublican party.

Gundula wrote: "Great review, and another book to add or download (maybe the latter as I have way too many paper books all over the house, in boxes etc.)."

Thank you, Gundula. Yes, it might be a good idea to read "American Fascists" as an e-book. It is a must-read, but it is not a book one is likely to read twice.

It's disheartening to know that people as ignorant of history, and as foolish as you sound, are able to vote. Lenin had a good phrase to describe those who do the work of the party elite for them, so they didn't have to do it themselves. I'm sure I don't need to tell you what it was. ("Goose stepping unwashed"--Really? Typical liberal who would describe his/her fellow countrymen in this way. Nice for you that you are so superior.)

Fred wrote: "One of the books on my "to read" list is Kevin Kruse's "One Nation Under God". One of the jacket blurbs says "Prepare yourself for a startling and important discovery: 'Christian America' is not a ..."

"One Nation Under God", by Kevin Kruse, is already on my TBR-list, and Bobby Sullivan, a new GR friend of mine, has written a short and very-much-to-the-point review of it. Here is the link to this review:

/review/show...

Peter wrote: "Lilo,

Great review. I must agree with everything you said

Peter
_______"

Thank you, Peter. Always nice to hear from you.

LVRichardson wrote: "It's disheartening to know that people as ignorant of history, and as foolish as you sound, are able to vote. Lenin had a good phrase to describe those who do the work of the party elite for them, ..."

If you support Donald Trump, you are, at best, naively ignorant. Do you really not see how dangerous and how close to the SA and the Nazis (and also the former GDR) he is?

Hi, LVRichardson. I haven’t heard from you in ages.

Well, I don’t think that it is ridiculous to worry about the Christian Right in this country. I don’t know what gives you the idea that the concept this country stands for (freedom of speech, religion, opportunity, etc.) is presently endangered by the political Left.

“Freedom of speech�� doesn’t mean “freedom to insult��, “freedom to distort facts or outright lie��, or “freedom to brainwash the stupid masses��. I don’t know the exact legal limits of “freedom of speech��, yet what several of the present GOP presidential candidates have been doing is, definitely, not what the Founding Fathers meant “freedom of speech�� to be.

You mention religion as endangered by the radical Left. Well, this might apply to a radical Left as it existed in communism of the Soviet Union. Yet I don’t see any such extreme Left in America, at least not with or anywhere near the Obama administration or anywhere near the Dem presidential candidates.—Bernie Sanders, the most left candidate, is not even a socialist; he is a social democrat, and this is quite a difference. The present Obama administration, all of the Dem presidential candidates, as well as all other leading Democrats I know are absolutely for “freedom of religion��, yet they are for “separation of religion and state�� (and this is very good so), which the political Right wants to abolish in every possible (open as well as sneaky) way.

You also mention "opportunity". I don't think the Founding Fathers meant with "opportunity" that the richest 2% in America should be able to get richer still by exploiting the working class.

Please note: I myself no longer belong to the working/middle class. I am retired, financially independent (partially due to inheritance), and what the English call "well to do". Thus, the tax laws proposed by the GOP candidates would benefit me. However, I consider it outright wrong to have the wealthy of the richest country in the world pay less taxes than they do in most other countries, while the working class and middle class are struggling to survive without a social net as it is taken for granted in European countries.

Take Germany, for instance: Germany is a capitalist country with a Conservative government. I am not saying that everything is perfect in Germany, but social justice works much better there than here in the U.S.--The wealthy pay high taxes. The attendance of college and university is free (administration fees are minuscule) and students with low-income parents are getting government money that enables them to study without working on the side. There is government health insurance. There is appropriate retirement pay. There is paid maternity leave. There is paid sick leave. There is job security. (Workers can only get fired for very severe reasons.) There is unemployment insurance. There are welfare programs. There are generous paid vacations. (A middle-aged employee who has been with the same company for some 20 years gets about 5 weeks vacation, and if he/she has any health conditions, it is about 6 weeks.) And, and, and, and, and ...

I am not saying that there aren't shortcomings, such as abuse of social benefits or employers stuck with no-good employees or, on the other hand, loopholes where people end up in poverty regardless of all the benefits (usually unsuccessful self-employed who lacked to provide for their retirement), but in general, the system works, whereas here, in the U.S., the system doesn't work because the rich can't get their belly full enough. I consider it outrageous that CEOs of corporations earn 2-digit million dollars a year, for which they even pay only moderate taxes, whereas the average American has no social security to speak of.

I might vote conservative in Germany (because conservatives are usually more talented to run a country than social democrats, as the ancestors of conservatives, quite often, ran a business), but I wouldn't be caught dead voting conservative here in the U.S., at least not, under the present circumstances. Consider me a "born again" Democrat.

@ Gundula:

I AGREE 100% WITH EVERYTHING YOU SAY.

Lilo wrote: "@ Gundula:

I AGREE 100% WITH EVERYTHING YOU SAY."

That LVRichardson is scary. Is he always like this?

Travelin wrote: "Where LVRichardson seems right is that politics of division based on personal style is taking precedence over real world issues. Plenty of people have survived Christian schools, but it's much hard..."

May I correct? You are right, many people have survived Christian schools, but some haven't, and I certainly don't want any people in government who have attended Christian schools and universities that teach that the universe is only 6015 years old, that teach the Rapture, and that declare every individual who doesn't believe exactly what these evangelicals believe as followers of Satan, who, of course, have to be destroyed.

Please read "American Fascists", Travelin. The author is no atheist fanatic; he is a Christian who has mastered in theology and is the son of a moderate Presbyterian minister. He knows what he is talking about.

LVRichardson wrote: "It's disheartening to know that people as ignorant of history, and as foolish as you sound, are able to vote. Lenin had a good phrase to describe those who do the work of the party elite for them, ..."

I am sorry, LVRichardson, but this is how I feel about you.

Gundula wrote: "Lilo wrote: "@ Gundula:

I AGREE 100% WITH EVERYTHING YOU SAY."

That LVRichardson is scary. Is he always like this?"

LVRichardson is a "she". If I remember correctly, she is a member of the Tea Party. I befriended her when she was badly insulted (in early September 2013) on the comment thread of Kemper's review of "In the Garden of Beasts", where she made a slightly critical but well-founded comment. I had come to her aid and was badly insulted along with her. (This review and comment thread had nothing to do with American politics.)

LVRichardson wrote: "Gundula wrote: I said that ALL RADICALS ar..."

And I say you're wrong. ALL radicals are NOT a threat. It takes no courage whatsoever to criticize Christians or even the Canadian PM. You KNOW nothi..."

ALL radicals ARE a threat, and it doesn’t matter whether they are political or religious. This country IS under threat from radical Christian conservatives. And the fact that corporate America is making itself an ally to these dominionist Christians, for opportunistic reasons, makes this threat even bigger.

I strongly suggest you read “American Fascists�� and also “It Can’t Happen Here��, by Lewis Sinclair. Here is the link to my review of “It Can’t Happen Here��:

/review/show...

Btw, I hope you are not an evangelical who believes in the Rapture. Otherwise, I would have to doubt your sanity.

I think it should be compulsory for everyone who believes in the bible literally to read at least one book that tells how the bible came to be. There are numerous versions of the bible (all of them selections and translations of old scriptures chosen and approved to suit the purposes of different emperors). With so many different versions, one can rule out that the bible was “dictated�� by God.

Moreover, churches (and especially fundamentalist churches) pick and choose from their chosen version of the bible whatever suits them. The bible is so contradictory that anyone can read out of it whatever he or she chooses.

Lilo wrote: "LVRichardson wrote: "Gundula wrote: I said that ALL RADICALS ar..."

And I say you're wrong. ALL radicals are NOT a threat. It takes no courage whatsoever to criticize Christians or even the Canadi..."

I said the same thing, that ALL radicals are a threat. Also, if LvRichardson thinks that Obama and company are radical left wingers, what would she consider the SPD etc to be. The Democrats are centrist, but the Tea Party, at least with their social and points, thei anti abortion, anti homosexual rhetoric, often sound like that which they claim to depise ...

Gundula wrote: "Lilo wrote: "LVRichardson wrote: "Gundula wrote: I said that ALL RADICALS ar..."

And I say you're wrong. ALL radicals are NOT a threat. It takes no courage whatsoever to criticize Christians or ev..."

I agree again with you, Gundula.

I despise the Tea Party ever since I saw members of it carry a big sign (in the 2012 elections) depicting President Obama as a cannibal. Their racism is so disgusting and no better than the anti-Semitism of the Nazis, who kept depicting Jews in the ugliest cartoons before they proceeded to murder them.

Lilo wrote: "Gundula wrote: "Lilo wrote: "LVRichardson wrote: "Gundula wrote: I said that ALL RADICALS ar..."

And I say you're wrong. ALL radicals are NOT a threat. It takes no courage whatsoever to criticize ..."

Good point, the Tea Party is the American version pf the Taliban and ISIS, maybe they are not as reactionary and violent at present, but they sure do have a similar mindset, at least many of them have.

I have been trying to replace the faulty last paragraph in my comment # 34, but the edit function doesn't work on this comment.

The parentheses in the last paragraph of this comment should read:

"I might vote conservative in Germany, because German conservatives are usually more talented to run the economy than German social democrats are. This is because the ancestors of German conservatives were, quite often, factory owners and business people, whereas the ancestors of most German social democrats were, in earlier years, blue collar workers and, in later years, teachers, none of which were experienced in economy. Actually, I used to be active in the FDP (during the 1970s), which covers the middle ground between the conservatives and the social democrats. Yet I wouldn't be caught dead voting conservative here in the U.S., at least not, under the present circumstances. Consider me a 'born again' Democrat."

Lilo wrote: "I have been trying to correct a mistake in my comment # 34, but the edit function doesn't work on this comment.

The parentheses in the last paragraph of this comment should read:

"(because conser..."

I would imagine that according to the most radical members of the Tea Party, the CDU and Angela Merkel would be considered as extreme left-wing, sigh.

Lilo wrote: "LVRichardson wrote: "Gundula wrote: I said that ALL RADICALS ar..."

And I say you're wrong. ALL radicals are NOT a threat. It takes no courage whatsoever to criticize Christians or even the Canadi..."

And the historical Jesus was for all intents and purposes, a Social Democrat, who believed in tolerance and who catered to and supported the poor. Today's radical Christian Right, at least many of its members, in Biblical times, would have been amongst the screaming hordes clamouring for Jesus' cruxifixction.

@ Gundula:

I suppose that the CDU and Angela Merkel would be considered as extreme left-wing by the most radical members of the Tea Party, just as moderate Christians are considered followers of Satan by the fundamentalist Christians.

The historical Jesus has nothing whatsoever to do with the fairy-tale Jesus Christian churches have invented or rather modeled over the centuries.

And of course, the historical Jesus was, for all intents and purposes, a socialist (i.e., quite a bit more left than the social democrats). Had he been a conservative, he would not have entered Jerusalem riding on a donkey but would have, at least, chosen a decorated elephant, which might have been the equivalent to the 1st class seat on a plane today's GOP candidates are likely to use, unless they have their private planes.

Yes, the historic Jesus (and even the fairy-tale Jesus) would, definitely, vote Democrat if he lived today, and I bet he would disturb the rallies and phony speeches of the GOP candidates. Remember, it says in the bible that he knocked over the tables of the Pharisees.

Lilo wrote: "@ Gundula:

I suppose that the CDU and Angela Merkel would be considered as extreme left-wing by the most radical members of the Tea Party, just as moderate Christians are considered followers of S..."

Exactly! The historical Jesus preached tolerance, humanity, empathy and aiding and supporting those less fortunate. And fundamentalist Christians, at least the most extreme versions thereof, are basically not only against the historical Jesus and his teachings, but are, the absolute opposite of Jesus, of what true Christianity should be. I say that as a lapsed Catholic, Unitarian and Liberal Quaker, who believes in Jesus, the historical Jesus, the one who also never claimed to be the son of God (and certainly never claimed to be akin to God).

Gundula wrote: "Lilo wrote: "@ Gundula:

I suppose that the CDU and Angela Merkel would be considered as extreme left-wing by the most radical members of the Tea Party, just as moderate Christians are considered f..."

AMEN!

Jesus, btw, never said that he was the only son of God; instead, he said (if I remember correctly, on several occasions) that we are all children of God.

This, of course, leads to the question: What is a child of God? And who would be the mother of such child? I don't think that Jesus meant this literally.

Btw, I was raised Catholic, accidentally got married in a United Church (my 1st husband was eager to get married when we had only been in Canada for a few months and let a colleague make the arrangements), converted to Lutheran (because my 1st husband did not want his daughter raised Catholic), was never active in the Lutheran Church, and left the Church when I got utterly annoyed with the minister, in connection with the funeral of my daughter. I am over and done with any organized religion. I don't think you need to show a batch to be admitted to heaven. Besides, I am more inclined to believe in reincarnation. Makes more sense to me than sitting on a cloud and singing Hosannah. :-)

Lilo wrote: "Gundula wrote: "Lilo wrote: "@ Gundula:

I suppose that the CDU and Angela Merkel would be considered as extreme left-wing by the most radical members of the Tea Party, just as moderate Christians ..."

Look at all the carnage and tears that have been part and parcel to almost ALL organised religions, both Christian and non Christian ...

@ Gundula: The author of the above book became a foreign correspondent (instead of being ordained after graduating in theology). He writes in the preface of the book that the worst cruelties he has seen committed all over the world have been committed in the name of God.

I am not surprised. It started with the crusades (or possibly even earlier), went on with the Inquisition, and has continued for centuries in the name of various religions, and all this while (most ?) religions teach that God is Love.

Lilo wrote: "@ Gundula: The author of the above book became a foreign correspondent (instead of being ordained after graduating in theology). He writes in the preface of the book that the worst cruelties he has..."

I do wonder why religion always brings out the worst in people.