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My main complaint was about her name. Renesmee??????? Every time I read it, I was like, "Ummm... le stupid!"

As for the hybrid thing.... Stephenie's always said that vampires can't have babies. Has she said anything about humans not being able to have vampires' babies? Or was that implied? I think she's been pretty careful to not say anything in that vein... Let's see... she said: (PC#1):

"I鈥檝e had tons of people ask if vampires can have babies. The answer is no. When someone becomes a vampire, it鈥檚 as if they are frozen exactly as they are in that moment. His or her (and we鈥檒l go with her because it鈥檚 more central to this discussion) body no longer experiences change. Hair does not grow, nor do fingernails (if you cut your hair, you鈥檙e stuck. That鈥檚 why Alice鈥檚 hair is so short鈥搃t was growing back from being shaved in the asylum). This applies to all changes鈥搒o a woman would no longer have any kind of ovulation cycle. If she were already pregnant when she was bitten, both she and the fetus would be frozen in that state. Which would really suck鈥損regnant for eternity? I鈥檓 shuddering at the thought."

Hmmm... yes... misleading, isn't it?

Yes I think it's misleading... the first paragraph of that same PC she says:

"Most human fluids are absent in my vampires. No sweat, no tears, no blood besides that which they ingest鈥搕hey don鈥檛 have their own blood. They do sort of have saliva鈥搕he venom makes their mouths wet, at least. When they drink blood, it runs through their body and makes them strong. It floods through their old blood ways, though they don鈥檛 have circulation anymore. It lightens their eyes* and flushes their skin slightly."

And then a couple paragraphs later she goes into what you quoted. However; what I find interesting is the one sentence you didn't quote: "And since we鈥檙e talking physiology鈥�" Since this question is talking about fluids and she goes into the "physiology" of being a vampire it's alluded that vampires don't have sperm. Now she doesn鈥檛 just come right out and say that but she may as well have, because clearly that鈥檚 the implication. But this is just her loop-hole for explaining the miraculous conception.

FYI: I have heard that certain religions actually have 'eternal pregnancy' as the highest honor for a woman. (Sounds like hell to me--but I guess I don't belong to that religion).

I think the whole baby thing was creepy!

Your review was fabulous!

"Most human fluids" is not the same as "ALL human fluids"... hmmmm.... But yes, I definitely think she was exploiting a loop-hole. I just didn't really mind as much as some people, I think. *shrugs*

I didn't think the baby thing was creepy, but my sister did. I mean the whole baby-coming-out-of-momma's-tummy-like-on-ALIEN thing was creepy, of course... but... yeah.... I didn't think the Bella-needed-to-drink-blood thing was strange or anything.... I mean, pregnant women ALWAYS crave whatever the baby wants. And if the baby is half-vampire, then... well...? What do you expect?

"Eternal pregnancy"? Ummm... Is she talking about Mormons? Because that's not really how I'd describe it.... not as "eternal pregnancy". Shoot me now. But it won't be like that--it will be different on the other side.

I don't know, that whole scene where Bella "gives birth" it's just weird... and yes I would say creepy! I kept thinking while I was reading it 鈥渕an, did Steph have some jacked up birthing experiences?!?鈥� hahaha鈥� It was gratuitous really, and unnecessary.

Now what would have been FANTASTIC is if she would have saved all the blood bit for the 鈥渨ar鈥� at the end. That would have gotten 2 stars out of me for sure!

P.S. Thanks for your comment Leslie!

I knew that Edward and Bella would have a baby. And the conception of their baby doesn't break Stephenie's rules. Wait, I"ll explain. Edward was "frozen" as a seventeen year old male and until his wedding night, was a virgin. That means that Edward would have one shot, so to speak, to impregnate Bella. His sperm wouldn't continually reproduce, but his "frozen" sperm would be there dormant, waiting, if you will. And Bella and Edward conceive during their first union. So, technically Edward could father a child.

However, all of the talk of the incubus, etc. Vampires should not be able to reproduce sperm, so fathering many children is totally impossible.
So the fact that Edward and Bella conceive I appreciate, but the many children of the incubuses (is that a word?) are not possible (according to Stephenie Meyer's theories).

And the imprinting thing--it blew me away. I was absolutely shocked and pretty much grossed out. (This came on the heels of my stomach being turned by Edward offering Bella to Jacob so Jacob could serve as stud. I understand why Edward did it, but it is pretty sick.) When Edward and Jacob discuss Bella in the tent scene in "Eclips," Edward says that if he stepped back and let Jacob and Bella be together, he'd always be waiting in the wings because Jacob might leave without a choice of his own--like Sam and Emily. HOwever, if Jacob and Bella had actually been together, Jake never would have imprinted because his true love, his connection in the world, was the child of Edward and Bella who would have never have existed if Bella and Jake had been together.

But, the whole thing grew on me, and I was thrilled that

a. we got to see Bella as a vampire--I thought we'd be waiting until the end of the series to see her become a vampire

b. Jake got over Bella without continued agony

c. Edward and Bella's love grew

d. Edward and Bella had a child (but why is Rosalie not more jealous?)

e. And I think that this is by far the most romantic of the books--and not just the frequent sex--I love how much Edward and Bella love each other. It is a true love story.

Thank you, Megan! As for d, I think at this point, Rosalie is perfectly happy to be able to raise Renesmee. If she can't have a baby of her own, she'll make do with having a very large part in raising Bella and Edward's baby. I think it might also have to do with the fact that Bella turned to her when she found out she was pregnant, and so there's a very special bond between Renesmee and Rosalie. Like a favorite aunt. :)

Did someone up there make a comment about how strange it was that Bella called Rosalie when she found out she was pregnant? Because I think it was the PERFECT choice. It had to be a vampire who would feel strongly about Bella having the baby, and who wouldn't be afraid to stand up to Edward. Who else COULD you have chosen? Rosalie was the PERFECT choice to protect her interests.

I agree with Megan. Bella got changed, Jake imprinted, Edward and Bella got married and had a baby, Emmett made a lot of sex jokes (I was sad when these stopped...), it was UBER-romantic, and everyone got to live happily ever after! YAY!

And I didn't even mind the Bella-giving-birth scene. *shrugs* I knew it was going to be bad, seeing as how the baby was breaking ribs and pelvises already... It just didn't bother me.

MY HUSBAND, however... he gets queasy when people talk about blood. It will be VERY INTERESTING watching him read that part.... heehee!

Thank you, Megan! As for d, I think at this point, Rosalie is perfectly happy to be able to raise Renesmee. If she can't have a baby of her own, she'll make do with having a very large part in raising Bella and Edward's baby. I think it might also have to do with the fact that Bella turned to her when she found out she was pregnant, and so there's a very special bond between Renesmee and Rosalie. Like a favorite aunt. :)

Did someone up there make a comment about how strange it was that Bella called Rosalie when she found out she was pregnant? Because I think it was the PERFECT choice. It had to be a vampire who would feel strongly about Bella having the baby, and who wouldn't be afraid to stand up to Edward. Who else COULD you have chosen? Rosalie was the PERFECT choice to protect her interests.

I agree with Megan. Bella got changed, Jake imprinted, Edward and Bella got married and had a baby, Emmett made a lot of sex jokes (I was sad when these stopped...), it was UBER-romantic, and everyone got to live happily ever after! YAY!

And I didn't even mind the Bella-giving-birth scene. *shrugs* I knew it was going to be bad, seeing as how the baby was breaking ribs and pelvises already... It just didn't bother me.

MY HUSBAND, however... he gets queasy when people talk about blood. It will be VERY INTERESTING watching him read that part.... heehee!

Ah... well see that's the beautiful thing about opinions. They are as unique and individual as the person who states them.

I still feel like the whole story was so contrived! And the whole being frozen a virgin is a HUGE stretch! And again, insulting to my intelligence, but that's just me, clearly!

The ending for me in COMPLETELY unrealistic! Even friends of mine that liked the book agree about that. If you're going to have a war, there need to be casualties on both sides. Not just a little chat and then everything is hunky-dory.

I know this is fiction but still the point to fiction is that an author can take a make-believe world and make it believable. Stephenie Meyer fell way short of doing that in this book, in my opinion.

I agree that the part with the Volturi is unrealistic. It would be more realistic if, although the Cullens won, someone (a Cullen) was a casualty. But I think that the Volturi felt threatened by all the vampires and wolves and by Bella's unique gifts. They should have fought, and because of Bella's skills they would have won. And wouldn't that have been fun to see Felix and Jane go down?

But ultimately, I love a good romance, and I LOVE Edward! So, for me, although Edward's request that Jake become Bella's "stud;" and Jake's imprinting on Renesmee (dumb name)disturbed me initially, I am very satisfied by the ending of the book.

P.S. I wonder if the Volturi didn't fight because ultimately they were the ruling vampire coven to keep the peace, not to exercise their will for politics, and they were "called on the carpet" by one of their own, therefore fearful to prove the truth of who they were, backed off. (Run on confusing sentence, I know.)

Megan--I think it's that and they realized that if they fought, everyone was going to die, and they just wanted to hold on to the power they had.

As for the Jake being a "stud"... I think the fact that Edward even THOUGHT that, let alone suggested it, was proof of exactly HOW WORRIED and UPSET Edward was about Bella. It was making him CRAZY! ;)

I'm glad none of the Cullens died. Who would you have wanted to die? (Duh, Rosalie... but what about Emmett??? Do you want Emmett to have to live with that for eternity??) Yes, it's cheesy beyond all belief, and no, it never would have happened, but still--vampires don't think the same way as humans (I'd venture to assume). Because they're immortal, I'd think they fear death more--they have more to lose. They haven't feared fighting before because they were practically invincible. Once they realized they were going to lose, though.... There's no way they'd fight. HOWEVER, I DO agree that it WAS pretty anticlimactic. And yes, I wish I could have seen Alex, Jane, Felix, and Demetri go down.

As for Edward being frozen a virgin, I don't think that's what she said. I think what she's saying is that male vampires continue to produce sperm after they are changed. At least, that's the way I read it.

Sara-

I didn't mean that I wanted any of the Cullens to go down--that would have been terrible. I just meant that it would be realistic, in a battle like that of the Volturi, to have casualties on both sides.

By saying that Edward was frozen a virgin, I didn't mean to imply that that is what Stephenie Meyer said. This is how I came to that conclusion:

Stephenie said as you and Laurie quoted earlier, When someone becomes a vampire, it鈥檚 as if they are frozen exactly as they are in that moment.

We know that Edward is a virgin (remember his conversation with Bella in her bedroom in "Twilight") and so it just stands to reason that he would be frozen with the sperm already in his body as a seventeen year old boy. That said, he would have one chance to "use" that sperm--assuming that vampires do not reproduce fluid. Therefore, Stephenie didn't break the rules when Bella conceived because it was the first time that Edward and Bella had sex; it was Edward's one chance to "use" his sperm. (Not to be crass. . .this conversation is kind of turning weird. . .)

However, Stephenie did break the rules when she described Nahuel's life. Because Nahuel had half-siblings, and Nahuel's father, a vampire, should not have been able to give Nahuel any siblings.

But Stephenie did try to make it work by having Carlisle mention that they had no idea that vampires could reproduce so he hadn't thought to warn Edward and Bella.

And I admire Edward for suggesting that Jacob father some more human children, it just turns my stomach to think of that. I understand that Edward was so overcome with grief and full of love that he was willing to do anything to save Bella and make her happy. But it bugs me that Jacob seemed okay with it and that he was willing to run it past Bella for Edward. Jake doesn't deserve Renesmee.

Meh... I'm married. You can't offend me! ;)

I don't know what to think. I need to go back and reread that part of the book. This is what I told one of my friends yesterday about what I t
thought Stephenie meant:

-----

*sigh* I think it's very questionable. It's all about Personal Correspondence #1:

"Q: Do the vampires have blood in their veins even though their heart no longer pumps? What would happen if they were cut or injured in some way?

"A: Most human fluids are absent in my vampires. No sweat, no tears, no blood besides that which they ingest鈥搕hey don鈥檛 have their own blood. They do sort of have saliva鈥攖he venom makes their mouths wet, at least. When they drink blood, it runs through their body and makes them strong. It floods through their old blood ways, though they don鈥檛 have circulation anymore. It lightens their eyes* and flushes their skin slightly. ....

"And since we鈥檙e talking physiology鈥� I鈥檝e had tons of people ask if vampires can have babies. The answer is no. When someone becomes a vampire, it鈥檚 as if they are frozen exactly as they are in that moment. His or her (and we鈥檒l go with her because it鈥檚 more central to this discussion) body no longer experiences change. Hair does not grow, nor do fingernails (if you cut your hair, you鈥檙e stuck. That鈥檚 why Alice鈥檚 hair is so short鈥搃t was growing back from being shaved in the asylum). This applies to all changes鈥搒o a woman would no longer have any kind of ovulation cycle. If she were already pregnant when she was bitten, both she and the fetus would be frozen in that state. Which would really suck鈥攑regnant for eternity? I鈥檓 shuddering at the thought."

(I took out the parts that didn't have anything to do with the issue.)

And the more I read that, the more I think everyone else is right. But I don't particularly care. Well, I do, but I can understand where Stephenie is coming from. ANYWAY. TECHNICALLY, the explanation Stephenie used works. She says that a woman's ovulation cycle is a change (a woman is constantly growing and shedding lining of the uterus and dropping eggs), and so becoming a vampire will cut that process off. Men, on the other hand, always produce sperm (from time of maturity to death)鈥攊t is CONSTANT (NOT a "change")鈥攁nd so her argument is that they would continue to produce sperm after becoming a vampire. It's just... vampire sperm. (I was also thinking that since sperm is created in a sac that is away from the body, it's kinda separate from the blood that is affected by venom during the change... which is how the sperm might survive the change. That's just me saying that. But I think that might have something to do with it.)

I think the argument is pretty weak, myself. But she's basically saying that a female vampire's body can't change (and thus can't become pregnant--no period, thus no eggs, and also no room for baby), but that a male vampire can impregnate (still sperm). Some people are saying that because Edward was a virgin, he had a single shot at impregnating Bella, but that can't be what she's saying, considering that one guy had 2 or 3 sisters or something by the same father.

I think it's very confusing... (AND I know ZERO about Biology...) I'm guessing that Stephenie wrote this answer (from PC #1) very carefully, so to not say something that would contradict her future plot, but I think that EVERYONE (myself included) assumed what her answer doesn't specifically say: "All vampires are sterile".

I think she's splitting hairs. But does that make sense at all?

-----

That's my understanding.

Yes, the whole Jacob-fathering-Bella's-babies thing.... *EEEEEKK!!!* I don't think Jacob really thought it was going to happen--he says so. But I think he told Bella Edward said that to show Bella how freaked Edward was.

Truth be told even if you throw out the whole baby and imprinting thing the story was still just so weak. And it was upsetting that her characters were... out of character. I mean Alice leaves and everyone is like "well I guess she's just saving her own hyde." WHAT? Like you haven't lived with this woman for the last 50+ years? You don't know her a little better than that? And Edward was all moopy and whiny. Emmett was a big perv, which made me sad.

Another element of the story that I totally still don't understand is why she changed perspective? Especially at such an important part of the book. So the moment we've all been waiting for, Bella changes and not only that she also has a child and we don't get any of her feelings for these two MAJOR events from her. No tender moments between her and Edward after having had a child together. No bonding moments with Bella and the baby, from her perspective. And what about the change? Nothing! In fact the one event that we鈥檝e all been waiting for is completely an after thought due to everything else that is going on at the time. That was tragic. There was so much that could have happened here and Stephenie failed horribly at providing it.

A friend of mine put it perfectly when she said that she was so sick of the endless, happily ever after鈥檚 that kept happening that by the time she got to the whole Charlie/Sue bit she wanted to scream. I wanted to chuck my book across the room!

So ultimately what I'm saying is that my dislike for this book and the reason I only gave it 1 star has SOOOO much more to do with the crap writing than the fact that Stephenie undid her own mythology.

Wow, I could not agree more.

To tell you the truth, I really disliked the fact that the storyline was based on the baby. Most teenagers don't care about giving birth. The storyline deviated so much from the reason most people were reading the Twilight series: Edward and Bella's love for each other/the Edward-Bella-Jacob love triangle.

Overall, it was slightly disappointing.